Topic: What's wrong with this picture?

[poconopenn]

supplied by panda america

It is very troublsome to see official distributor in US to reseal MCC by a third party without make any disclaimer.

[wg]

The Shanghai Memory medal was numbered individually on obverse. This is one of the reason I have recommended this medal highly in other thread, since each medal was made with different die. The pouch is genuine Shanghai mint.

thanks for reply

the answer ...

Hi,
Long story in short, some seals got open when shipped from Shanghai to US.
So the Spungen family fundation (the co-issuer of this medal) re-sealed some of them.

we are one of the official distributors for this medal and we tried to give u the consecutive numbers. Maybe that is why u had a couple of re-sealed ones.

if u do not like, we can exchange for u. But all the medals are in GEM proof condition. we did not cherry pick any.

BTW, other distributors just cut the seal and sell the medals in capsule only.

Thanks for your business.

Min

- qianscoins
   

[wg]

More examples of Shenyang Mint seal pattern for silver coins..

can you tell me which year shenyang mint started with this pattern?

thank you

[Hippanda]

I was looking.
1985 earliest I have seen.

[Hippanda]

Yet ANOTHER example - this is an accelerating plague of deception and fraud. Who is doing this?  
This auction from Coinnext shows a 1990 Small Date and Large Date, the Small Date on the left is apparently resealed in the same "Faux" mint wrap as in so many coins now popping up including the one that started this thread the 2001.
(Note : the seal in the 1990 besides being the wrong pattern doesn't even match up on the side.)

So who here is connected well enough to ask Coinnext, Panda America and Apmex what their source is for these coins?
Why is Panda Will of Panda America silent? Seems some representative of these dealers should post here their answers and if this is going to be a continued or discontinued practice in light of the fact its now been exposed? Continued silence from them is just bad business.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Lot-of-2-1990-5-Yuan-1-20-999-Gold-Pandas-both-in-Mint-Seal-Large-Small-Date-/321216490456?pt=US_World_Coins&hash=item4ac9feabd8

[NBM]

I'm beginning to think the older Panda market is at least half a casino with the large players pushing the prices around and dealing from another deck to suit their hands.
I feel like the guy at the poker table who is wondering who the sucker is.

Fixed my post.

[Hippanda]

Well put.

[poconopenn]

can you tell me which year shenyang mint started with this pattern?

thank you

1985 was the first year that BU gold panda made at Shenyang Mint. 1982-1984 were made at Shanghai only.

[poconopenn]

Buy the coin, not the package or holder. Buy PA's book first, before buy the coins. PA's book has the best pictures of panda coins anywhere in the world.

[Hippanda]

Buy the coin, not the package or holder. Buy PA's book first, before buy the coins. PA's book has the best pictures of panda coins anywhere in the world.

Of course. Its just sad that rule needs to be heeded to be avoid taken advantage of by large dealers who should be honest.  And aren't.  See NBM's comment. Its ok for experienced buyers, knowing the inside secrets of reseals and cheats.  But to just leave it at that, and have new collectors be taken advantage of while they learn, just isn't right. Thanks Poconopenn for always stepping forward and helping id fakes.  And wg and other European collectors. And of course Panda Collector who has a site dedicated to it.
But the silence of the other long term members and leaders is strange and dissappointing.

Hey- how about this for an idea?  All the member dealers here, can log in and say "I reject the idea of reseals, and never sell them".  That way members can decide who is trustworthy and steer their business accordingly.
Those who are conspicuous by their silence, can be assumed to sell reseals or want the option to sell reseals.

[GDG's]

>>>Hey- how about this for an idea?  All the member dealers here, can log in and say "I reject the idea of reseals, and never sell them".  That way members can decide who is trustworthy and steer their business accordingly.
Those who are conspicuous by their silence, can be assumed to sell reseals or want the option to sell reseals.<<<

Good idea but fat chance. Since many doing this are the larger dealers I liken it to shooting oneself in their own foot. I appreciate all your fine posts in uncovering these cheats.

[wg]

 
hp&poconopenn

.

 

today i get the first time pics (ebay)

hc 10394 i send back ... he will look closer

best regards

[NBM]

wg, Hippanda etc.,
When you post these pictures could you label them or comment as to what you are seeing?
Others, like myself, may be having trouble understanding or seeing what you are pointing out.

In this post: http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=9459.msg55395#msg55395
wg says "supplied by panda america".
I see what looks to be 1/2 oz coins, (1983, 1991, 1992, 1993 & 2000 all in the same seal?
Which mint's seal is this and when was it used?

The one that really confuses me is the Shanghai Ghetto medal.
I have no idea what I am looking at with this one.
I thought China Mint had done away with seals on their official products.
This is not true for medals?
These are all the same or different seals?

[Hippanda]

In this post: http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=9459.msg55395#msg55395
wg says "supplied by panda america".
I see what looks to be 1/2 oz coins, (1983, 1991, 1992, 1993 & 2000 all in the same seal?
Which mint's seal is this and when was it used?

The ones wg posted are apparently not of any real mint.  They apparently try to imitate Shanghai Mint with its small slanted rectangles/. Similar to the fake posted on the first post of this thread with the 2001 coin.

For the ones eurokrem posted, those are VERY sloppily done, none of them appear to have even been cut square.

It would be embarrasing to think a big distributor could have done them in-house with those poor results. But they certainly know better, what real mint seals are, and would know they are "aftermarket" fakes even if they didnt seal them in-house. Why doesn't the alleged seller come on here and tell the story and clear the air?  Silence appears damning.

[wg]

( .. )

The one that really confuses me is the Shanghai Ghetto medal.
I have no idea what I am looking at with this one.
I thought China Mint had done away with seals on their official products.
This is not true for medals?
These are all the same or different seals?

 ordered this one
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=121171964039&ssPageName=ADME:X:eRTM:US:1123
Silver Proof Medal w/OMP
i get two medals ...
the shanghai mint packing was opened and closed again ... only burned, no pattern.
.
the last answer from the dealer