Author Topic: COIN VS MEDAL MCC  (Read 18229 times)

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Online pandamonium

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COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« on: July 22, 2013, 11:07:05 PM »
Since I got into this market the advice was to buy Chinese coins and not medals.   As this market moves along I do not read too much difference in buying Chinese coins vs medals.   Not too many debates or comments either.  Am I missing something?   It seems medals are still lower price than Yuan sign coins.  I own both.   Are Chinese Coins still the best of the market?  Have medals become more accepted?.............

Offline fwang2450

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Re: COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« Reply #1 on: July 23, 2013, 03:01:52 PM »
It really depends on your purpose for MCC. If you are investing, coins are still a safer bet (even the circulating coins). There is no obvious shift of attitude among the Chinese collectors. But medals are fun to collect and research on, and sometimes you may hit a jackpot. My recent purchases included one silver (or silver plated) medal and two brass medals. I know the brass ones, but the silver one is something to be researched on:

Offline exchange

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Re: COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2013, 05:08:29 PM »
Since I got into this market the advice was to buy Chinese coins and not medals.   As this market moves along I do not read too much difference in buying Chinese coins vs medals.   Not too many debates or comments either.  Am I missing something?   It seems medals are still lower price than Yuan sign coins.  I own both.   Are Chinese Coins still the best of the market?  Have medals become more accepted?.............

To me as long as the medal is an official product from the PRC, and not privately done i'm ok with it.
Most medals were privately minted. Even though they were minted in one of the major official Chinese mints, it does not mean they were officially released by the PRC.

examples of non official PRC medals: panda medal for the ANA show in philly, Singapore Panda Show Medal, etc...
http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=5891.0
http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=5165.0



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Offline fwang2450

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Re: COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2013, 09:38:09 PM »
To me as long as the medal is an official product from the PRC, and not privately done i'm ok with it.
Most medals were privately minted. Even though they were minted in one of the major official Chinese mints, it does not mean they were officially released by the PRC.

examples of non official PRC medals: panda medal for the ANA show in philly, Singapore Panda Show Medal, etc...
http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=5891.0
http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=5165.0

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The problem is that often it is hard to tell which is official, which is semi-official (like those in my post on Feng Yunming), and which is private. Many are borderline cases. Do those brass medals below look official or semi-official or private?

Offline fwang2450

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Re: COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2013, 09:44:06 PM »
Few Chinese can resist the privately minted medals below. Their price shot up 900% in two years.

Offline Bearcat

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Re: COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« Reply #5 on: July 23, 2013, 09:54:11 PM »
Hey cool, I've got one of the medals pictures..the China Mint Company 1980 in brass. Mine came individually boxed. I've had it many years and don'r remember where it got. I figured it was some kind of gift from a China Mint official Can you provide any more information? Thanks.

Offline fwang2450

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Re: COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2013, 10:11:20 PM »
Hey cool, I've got one of the medals pictures..the China Mint Company 1980 in brass. Mine came individually boxed. I've had it many years and don'r remember where it got. I figured it was some kind of gift from a China Mint official Can you provide any more information? Thanks.
These were minted in 1979 by Shanghai mint. The whole set, named "Auspicious Palace Lanterns" from the palace lantern design, consisted of 6 brass medals, depicting the dragon, the phoenix, and some other auspicious animals. The medals with 1980 on the lantern side are extremely difficult to find in China and highly prized. The copper/bronze/brass medal guru in China, Yin Guoqing, mentioned in 2011 that he had never seen one himself. RAREMEDAL had a pair like those shown in my post and sold them recently. Later stikes without "1980", some gold plated, are more common.

You got a treasure in your hand. If your medal is in good condition, you can ask NGC to grade it. NGC does accept these medals.

Offline Russ 736

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Re: COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« Reply #7 on: July 23, 2013, 10:29:17 PM »
Are there any books that you or other forum members would recommend that cover modern Chinese medals. The ones I have looked at seem to concentrate on the very large bronze medals but don't really cover all of the sizes or medals. Thanks for your thoughts on this.

Russ

Offline fwang2450

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Re: COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« Reply #8 on: July 24, 2013, 01:51:06 AM »
Are there any books that you or other forum members would recommend that cover modern Chinese medals. The ones I have looked at seem to concentrate on the very large bronze medals but don't really cover all of the sizes or medals. Thanks for your thoughts on this.

Russ
I am not aware of any books dedicated to all the medals of the PRC. Official medals are covered as part of the official coin catalogs, much like Peter's panda book listing panda medals. In addition, catalogs by private organizations or individuals cover some medals. The brass medals above are listed in the 1987 catalog by Shanghai Numismatic Society covering PRC coins and medals from 1979 to 1984. But many of the semi-official or private medals are not systematically listed anywhere. There are too many of them and the early medals were even less well documented than early coins. There are some blogs that cover specific topics, such as lunar medals from Shanghai or Shenyang Mint. The medal guru Yin Guoqing lists about 1000 medals in his blog: http://blog.sina.com.cn/s/articlelist_1340472803_0_1.html, with background of each of the medals.

Offline Russ 736

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Re: COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« Reply #9 on: July 24, 2013, 08:04:13 AM »
Thank you for the blog site and the insight on the book situation.

Russ

Offline exchange

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Re: COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« Reply #10 on: July 24, 2013, 02:56:44 PM »
The problem is that often it is hard to tell which is official, which is semi-official (like those in my post on Feng Yunming), and which is private. Many are borderline cases. Do those brass medals below look official or semi-official or private?

You're absolutely right. It can be quite difficult to differentiate from official and not. Going based on experience and what ever research I could do, these medals seem official. The latch on the box are the same as the latch found on the official box for the 1979 gold medals from the Beijing Scenary set. Below is a picture of the latch from my set.

Now I know the word fakes, copies, duplicates, etc... can come into play, but having its original contents as issued can be a very important clue in determining its origin.


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Offline fwang2450

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Re: COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« Reply #11 on: July 24, 2013, 05:31:31 PM »
These were minted in 1979 by Shanghai mint. The whole set, named "Auspicious Palace Lanterns" from the palace lantern design, consisted of 6 brass medals, depicting the dragon, the phoenix, and some other auspicious animals. The medals with 1980 on the lantern side are extremely difficult to find in China and highly prized. The copper/bronze/brass medal guru in China, Yin Guoqing, mentioned in 2011 that he had never seen one himself. RAREMEDAL had a pair like those shown in my post and sold them recently. Later stikes without "1980", some gold plated, are more common.

You got a treasure in your hand. If your medal is in good condition, you can ask NGC to grade it. NGC does accept these medals.
One correction. The 1979 set has 5, not 6, brass medals in it: double dragon, dragon and phoenix, phoenix alone, cranes and kylin. Web search only turns out the first three. The last two have never been seen, although they are available without 1980 on the lantern side, presumably restrikes: http://shop71089870.taobao.com/?q=%B9%AC%B5%C6&searcy_type=item&s_from=newHeader&source=&ssid=s5-e&search=y&initiative_id=itemz_20130724. Obviously more animals were added later on, such as the lion and the elephant.

Online pandamonium

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Re: COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« Reply #12 on: July 24, 2013, 09:38:53 PM »
The Chinese collectors may still favor coins and not medals.  Yet some medals have gone up 900%.   The attitudes against them 2 yrs ago have faded.  They have low mintages, some great designs and have not been researched as well as coins.  I see a bright future for certain Chinese medals.  Those that have a clue are grabbing the best while they are cheap..........Will we ever see level playing field for medals and coins?...........   

Offline trozau

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Re: COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« Reply #13 on: July 26, 2013, 04:46:23 PM »
Medal issue mintages are miniscule compared to coin issue mintages. Medals are less known so they have remained sleepers with great potential (although as mentioned in the above posts, they are beginning to be recognized by more people). Based on very low mintage/rarity, I would venture a WAG that they still have a much higher upward appreciation in the future.  :thumbup1:     
trozau (troy ounce gold)
honi soit qui mal y pense

gold - the barbarous relic!

Online pandamonium

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Re: COIN VS MEDAL MCC
« Reply #14 on: August 02, 2013, 08:44:04 AM »
I posted this earlier somewhere.   This medal is rare, 1982 Bank of China.  NGC has graded 5 total.   One PF 68, three 67 and one 64.  A PF 67 came up for sale about 6 months ago and sold quickly for $499.  Mr Gee says 16,000 planned mintage w/ 2 stars but most dealers and collectors cannot find them.   I have seen 3 (maybe 4) of them for sale on ebay in about the last yr.  The comments I receive is that they were probably melted.  Could there be a hoard of them in Germany or Japan?   The 82 Bank of China has not been studied to my knowledge.  Another MCC puzzle.........does anyone have any information on them?.........