Author Topic: Badon resigns? No way!  (Read 19346 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline SANDAC

  • Supporter
  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (+8)
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2224
  • Karma: 117
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #15 on: October 28, 2012, 06:32:29 PM »
Poconopenn's departure is entirely his own decision.  I believe I can speak for the entire staffs that we'll be delighted for his return, if he so chose.  His calm demeanor and quiet authority are sorely missed by all.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2012, 06:35:11 PM by SANDAC »

Offline davidt3251

  • Trade Count: (+6)
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 504
  • Karma: 5
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #16 on: October 28, 2012, 06:46:54 PM »
Sadly, this forum has degenerated into quite the shambles.

First of all, to accuse Badon of pumping certain coins because he owned them is an utter joke beyond belief. Not only did his recommended coins cover most of the MCC landscape (eg all Pandas, Lunars etc) but cornering that market would require substantial wealth.

If you ban Badon you may as well ban Mr Ge's book and Panda Collector (oh right, he quit already) and...and...

Second, even the coins Badon most loudly pounded the table on (Pagodas, God of Wealth, Goldfish) have been easily available at lower prices over the past two years.

Considering the banning of these individuals is a group effort ('consensus of staff'), and because CCF is only as good as its members, the banning of active members constitutes a significant loss of intellectual property.

Therefore, before going forward, each member deserves to know

1. the reasoning of each staffs decision to ban a member
and
2. the coin holdings of each staff that has the power to ban a member

Otherwise as much conflict of interest has been created by the bans as has been resolved.

This whole episode stinks to high heaven and its no surprise certain members of the MCC community decide not to participate here.


Offline GDG's

  • Trade Count: (+4)
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 651
  • Karma: 45
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #17 on: October 28, 2012, 06:48:23 PM »
Yes I believe I did say Poconopenn left of his own accord. I also said he did so for noble reasons.

Underbidder and Comeaux were banned and SANDAC knows why. I know why. Many others know why. Badon/qwasty knows why. But no one has posted the true reason. To keep any Ban on ANYONE yet allow badon/qwasty to post is SICK. You know why I choose that particular word. Are all administrators truly in the loop?

Offline SANDAC

  • Supporter
  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (+8)
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2224
  • Karma: 117
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #18 on: October 28, 2012, 07:30:14 PM »
Yes, staffs of recent past are in the loop.  I said "staffs of recent past" because I don't want to drag Birdman into this mudhole.  He had graciously agreed to help out after PandaCollector resigned, and this is hardly the way to pay for his generosity.

The simple fact is this: banning is hard, resignation is easy (this is an unpaid job).  We've already lost a valued member, a great moderator and an experienced adminstrator.  Let's work together and make this a great place to talk about coins.

Offline Obsidian

  • Supporter
  • Trade Count: (+7)
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 587
  • Karma: 32
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #19 on: October 28, 2012, 08:11:09 PM »

First of all, to accuse Badon of pumping certain coins because he owned them is an utter joke beyond belief. Not only did his recommended coins cover most of the MCC landscape (eg all Pandas, Lunars etc) but cornering that market would require substantial wealth.

If you ban Badon you may as well ban Mr Ge's book and Panda Collector (oh right, he quit already) and...and...

Second, even the coins Badon most loudly pounded the table on (Pagodas, God of Wealth, Goldfish) have been easily available at lower prices over the past two years.

Considering the banning of these individuals is a group effort ('consensus of staff'), and because CCF is only as good as its members, the banning of active members constitutes a significant loss of intellectual property.


David, no offense but claiming Badon pumped coins he owned is NOT an utter joke.  It was clear he "favored" certain coins.  He wrote huge articles on Pagodas and talked about them at length in his Investment Lists.  The highest prices of Pagodas and God of war were reached around the time he was writing about them!  The problem is the hype didn't continue.  The high prices brought out more and more, thus driving prices down.  

Here is a picture, one of the VERY few, Badon has ever posted on the forum:

http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=6487.15

He didn't say these were his coins but I can't imagine he would post someone elses with crediting the picture to them.  Look at the coins; pagodas, goldfish, god of wars, etc.

That is the point of pumping coins.  You buy a bunch for cheap then advertise them.  I don't think Badon was planning on pumping and dumping (at least not yet)  but he definitely was pumping.  Being an adminstrator and the blatant way he did it is questionable.

Take myself.  Look at my signature, it is clear I collect, among other things, 1/10 oz gold pandas.  You don't see me running around the forum constantly cheering 1/10 oz gold pandas.  If I were an admin and was doing that it would be even more annoying.  Although having it in my signature is technically "advertising" or "bragging" I suppose!  I guess I am mostly promoting the NGC registry since I think it is a great tool for collectors.  I have no affiliation with NGC  :001_tt2:

« Last Edit: October 28, 2012, 08:17:53 PM by Obsidian »

Offline coinstat

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 62
  • Karma: 4
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #20 on: October 28, 2012, 08:18:47 PM »
@GDG
I do not have a clue about the background of badon. Also I do not share his opinion on all topics and skip some paragraphs in his writings, but he contributed with a lot of work and knowledge and was always there to help. Loosing Poconopenn finally would be an unimaginable loss for the quality of the forum. Comeaux also contributed a lot of content and I would like to hear from him again.

Another topic, which may be related to the discussion:
I have no illusion that in all forums professional coin dealers participate a lot. And that may also include bringing up uncertainty for coins they want to buy and highlight coins they want to sell. Nearly nobody discusses specific coins without any relation to them.
I have seen many attempts to put a flag on (the profile of) professional coin dealers and no attempt ever succeeded.

Everybody with enough money to buy MCC’s should be able to decide what to do with it. There is no free lunch and you cannot get rich by buying something. Should everything be only about money?

SANDAC: Let's work together and make this a great place to talk about coins.
 :thumbup:

Offline Obsidian

  • Supporter
  • Trade Count: (+7)
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 587
  • Karma: 32
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #21 on: October 28, 2012, 08:32:20 PM »
I would also like to add, using the forum statistics posted by Badon in his Investment List #165:

http://www.LBC/smf/index.php?topic=5221.0

5 of the top 10 posters are now either restricted from posting or have chosen to participate to a lesser degree.  That clearly is not a good thing.

I don't think there is any reason most of those members can't be brought back and allowed to participate either from removal of the bans or from support from the rest of us.

I would also like to suggest that the moderators and / or Snowball communicate with the forum.  If the bans will or will not be removed, when, etc.  I think a lot of frustration from certain members could have been or can be avoided if more communication were employed.  With any PR problem it is best to be ahead of it instead of playing catch up.  I feel a lot of catch-up has been played.

« Last Edit: October 28, 2012, 10:15:29 PM by Obsidian »

Offline BronzeEmu

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 59
  • Karma: 3
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #22 on: October 28, 2012, 08:58:35 PM »
DavidT, you are a wize man in MCC. Do you think the Baden affect had nothing to do with the price hike of the GoW? It certainly brought it into the spotlight. I watched it's price slide also. If you bought at the top(you most likely didnt) & had to sell at a loss, that's bad business. I think it's called manipulation! I've read archives stating that Baden did not want to write about something until he held a position. That's being aware of manipulation. So I guess it's up to the individual to decide if this is ethical & as this is a private site & there is no impeachment process, the upset individuals got frustrated & angry.

What amazed me:
Shocking revelation about Baden not entering his own coins in CC.
For whatever reason, it looked deceitful, upset ppl & caused animosity.
&
The way respected members responded with emotionally charged backlash was terrible but it was because: Q's not answered clearly, we are financially involved at many levels & to find the pied piper did not jump off the cliff also clearly separates the group causing animosity & fracture.

If someone sells you something you ask "what's it taste like?", if they reply "never tasted it", do you buy? Im sure Brad Pitt doesn't wear Chanel but his reputation is now behind the brand. If they find it casnigenic his rep is smeared. Same with MrShamWow. Integrity is sooo important. I didn't care if Clinton shagged fattys but he shouldn't have got caught because many ppl didn't like the fact. Had nothing to do with his fiscal direction or policy, it showed lack of respect & proved him dishonest. He got the sack! Baden resigned of his own free will.

I agree with Obsidian on much!
If it quacks like a duck, no matter the regime, it is still a duck! Sad state of affairs.

Offline SANDAC

  • Supporter
  • Global Moderator
  • Trade Count: (+8)
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2224
  • Karma: 117
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #23 on: October 28, 2012, 09:00:51 PM »
We buy and hold coins, we come here to talk about coins, we are bullish about coins.  The members who posted the most become adminstrator and moderators.  They are the biggest cheerleaders of this bullish crowd.  So you are entirely correct, that administrator along with the members pump up MCC.  When Pagoda and GOW peaked, all MCC peaked.  Badon is good, but not that good.  A rising tide lifts all boats, he is just riding along in his boat celebrating with everyone else.  The picture he posted is indeed not his.  See his explaination a few posts later:  http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=6487.msg39403#msg39403

If a message from CCF adminstrator on behalf of the entire staffs started with this line:
Congratulation, you are invited to join the CCF staff, a volunteering position.   Please submit your entire holding of coins with weekly updates ready for immediate public release...  I don't think I'll join then, nor now.  Will you?

Offline Panda Express

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 153
  • Karma: 2
  • Gender: Male
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #24 on: October 28, 2012, 10:28:20 PM »
Yes I believe I did say Poconopenn left of his own accord. I also said he did so for noble reasons.

Underbidder and Comeaux were banned and SANDAC knows why. I know why. Many others know why. Badon/qwasty knows why. But no one has posted the true reason. To keep any Ban on ANYONE yet allow badon/qwasty to post is SICK. You know why I choose that particular word. Are all administrators truly in the loop?

Just as we try to stamp out online fraud, shenanigans, and shill bidding with online sellers and buyers, we should also be vigilant to call out any forms of malfeasance past or present that may make this way through this forum.  Sweeping dust under the carpet only discredits and holds this forum to a low moral standard.  We can talk about MCCs all day but it does not wipe away the truth.

Offline dynamike51

  • Supporter
  • Trade Count: (+15)
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 710
  • Karma: 39
  • Gender: Male
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #25 on: October 28, 2012, 10:43:29 PM »
Just as we try to stamp out online fraud, shenanigans, and shill bidding with online sellers and buyers, we should also be vigilant to call out any forms of malfeasance past or present that may make this way through this forum.  Sweeping dust under the carpet only discredits and holds this forum to a low moral standard.  We can talk about MCCs all day but it does not wipe away the truth.

Panda Express:

100% in agreement with ya !!!

Not to stand on a "political correctness" soap box, but what PE said is very true. To stand silently by and allow cyber crimes to happen affects all of us. Internet is a strange environment where people can post and say things without consequences, and criminals with evil intentions can blend in and pretend to be one of us to commit misdeeds.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2012, 11:11:36 PM by dynamike51 »

low

  • Guest
  • Trade Count: (0)
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #26 on: October 29, 2012, 02:00:24 AM »
If a message from CCF adminstrator on behalf of the entire staffs started with this line:
Congratulation, you are invited to join the CCF staff, a volunteering position.   Please submit your entire holding of coins with weekly updates ready for immediate public release...  I don't think I'll join then, nor now.  Will you?

Read this!

http://coin001.cn/read.php?tid=18840

在香港,一个评论某某股票的人必须在评论结束,公布自己是否持有这个股票,虽然这仅仅是一个形式话的承诺,但是你们这些版主连起码的承诺都给出。

But don't get me wrong, I am not interest in your coin holding. I have learnt to never trust any investment advice.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2012, 02:08:43 AM by low »

Offline badon

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4487
  • Karma: -81
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #27 on: October 29, 2012, 02:51:41 AM »
Hi everyone! I just found this discussion, and I must say, it is an interesting read. Now that I'm just a regular member, I can see things from your point of view quite a bit better now. At first I thought the accusations of pumping and other misdeeds were totally random, but now I can see why you might be suspicious. A few things I want to mention:

1. God of war & wealth prices were already rising when I became interested in them and started writing about them. If I remember correctly, they had already gained something like 400% by the time I started buying them and writing about them (up from $140).

2. I try to own the coins before I write about htem. The reason why I prefer to wait to write about coins until after I have bought them is because it is an important gauge of just how confident I am about a coin's investment potential. If I hesitate to buy it for myself, then I know I shouldn't be recommending it for other people.

3. I could never afford to buy all the coins I want. I mention 1995 1 oz gold proof pandas pretty frequently, for example. Those are so expensive, I can't afford to buy them every time they show up on eBay, even though I would very much like to. I blow through my cash fast buying up as much as I can as quickly as I can, and then I'm cash-poor for a while. When that happens, I write about interesting coins. God of war & wealth are interesting because they're popular, good investments, AND there are 6 known varieties. God of longevity is very similar - why doesn't anyone accuse me of pumping longevities? I write a LOT about lunars and 70 grade coins. Most of the coins I buy are often so rare that pumping would be useless. God of longevity, 70 grades, many of the lunars, and the 1995 1 oz gold proof panda are all too rare to benefit anybody with pumping. That's why dealers like marketing small size gold pandas - they're popular and available for buying and selling. I have invested in those too!

4. I rarely sell my coins. When I do, it's usually sold to a dealer or given away in a trade (usually to dealers again).

5. I am famous for overpaying. Very often it's my own articles that make the coins I buy so expensive. I have often lost money over the short term. In fact, I don't think there are any coins I own that I have not lost money on soon after I bought it. My buying strategy is very bizarre, but it works for me. Instead of buying at the lows, I try to buy at the peaks. I make the same percentage profits as everybody else over the long term! "Pumping" does not help my buying strategy. Pumping doesn't work without dumping, and my buying strategy usually ensures I'm the buyer if there is "pumping" going on.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2012, 02:54:22 AM by badon »

low

  • Guest
  • Trade Count: (0)
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #28 on: October 29, 2012, 09:57:10 PM »
各位认识与不认识的朋友,如您选择相信真相,就请静下心,真相比您想像中丑陋何止千万倍!就怕忠言逆耳,您听不进。
顺道交代,我纯粹喜欢金银币,不作投资,更厌恶利益份子在此炒作。

badon,遇见你,岂止三生不幸!时间到了,该下车了!多行不义必自毙!好自为之

Offline dynamike51

  • Supporter
  • Trade Count: (+15)
  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 710
  • Karma: 39
  • Gender: Male
Re: Badon resigns? No way!
« Reply #29 on: October 29, 2012, 09:59:07 PM »
各位认识与不认识的朋友,如您选择相信真相,就请静下心,真相比您想像中丑陋何止千万倍!就怕忠言逆耳,您听不进。
顺道交代,我纯粹喜欢金银币,不作投资,更厌恶利益份子在此炒作。

badon,遇见你,岂止三生不幸!时间到了,该下车了!多行不义必自毙!好自为之

Low,

Words of wisdom, indeed.