Author Topic: Post your newest older Chinese coin  (Read 80167 times)

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Offline Birdman

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #105 on: April 20, 2013, 08:36:40 AM »
Dragondollar,

You are amassing an enviable collection.  Thanks for sharing  N47

Offline dragondollar

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #106 on: April 20, 2013, 08:44:10 AM »
I wish to post a primer on Peiyang 1908 die varieties sometime next month, I think besides the classic "cross 4" most other varieties are not well-known in the US. Some of you guys may have some interesting coins erroneously slabbed Y73.2...

Offline dragondollar

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #107 on: April 29, 2013, 03:35:07 AM »
Another very rare Chihli 1908 (more rare than the 卷3旗4), the ugly 3 :

I sent it to PCGS. PCGS-ASIA, I hope you guys already know this variety and will label accordingly!

Offline dragondollar

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #108 on: June 27, 2013, 12:39:44 AM »
As a preview for my overdue blog post about Kiangnan pearl scales dragon, here is a high grade specimen I recently bought  N4

Offline Birdman

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #109 on: June 27, 2013, 08:51:06 AM »
As a preview for my overdue blog post about Kiangnan pearl scales dragon, here is a high grade specimen I recently bought  N4

Again, nice!

Offline poconopenn

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #110 on: July 07, 2013, 03:11:30 PM »
呵呵, after one year I finally found another Peiyang with dots...
http://www.dragondollar.com/coins/china-empire/1908-chihli-dollar-with-dots/

This variety is quite interesting. I have the theory that the 1911 central mint dot after dollar, Kiangnan 1904 dot before 7 and this variety were minted in 1911 from old dies as emergency currency, and the dots were added to identify the restruck coins (which may not have been of the same purity or consistent quality). On the aforementioned coin types, the dot is always around the English denomination, since the Peiyang dollar does not have an English denomination and already had dots around the legend, putting the dot in the center would be a plausible idea...

This variety is very rare though, I had a hard time finding this new specimen.

dragondollar,

I must miss this post before. The PCGS slab as shown in your picture is definitely a fake. Please examine the coin again.

Offline 从心出发

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #111 on: July 07, 2013, 11:31:00 PM »
Poconopenn,

While I don't know what the actual holder is, I believe it is not PCGS.

Offline dragondollar

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #112 on: July 08, 2013, 04:04:42 AM »
Don't worry, this is not a slabbed coin  :001_smile: The box is one of these PCCB boxes used in China, that are not sealed but looks similar to grading company holders. The coin inside is definitely authentic, but the toning is most likely artificial (or due to the cleaning agent used).

Offline Birdman

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #113 on: August 24, 2013, 08:57:03 AM »
I'll share an Annam piece I won at the recent Stacks Bowers Hong Kong Auction.  ANNAM. 7 Tien, ND (1848-83). Tu Duc. KM-468; Sch-347c.

As with some other Annam pieces I have posted, I am always curious as to what the Chinese characters mean.  If a forum member would be willing to translate, I'd be appreciative.  N38.




Offline dragondollar

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #114 on: August 24, 2013, 09:23:59 AM »
The characters are simply 嗣德通寶, basically "Coin of the Realm of emperor Tu Duc". Beautiful coin, did you buy it raw or slabbed? It looks XF45 or better.

Offline Birdman

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #115 on: August 24, 2013, 09:38:10 AM »
I'll share an Annam piece I won at the recent Stacks Bowers Hong Kong Auction.  ANNAM. 7 Tien, ND (1848-83). Tu Duc. KM-468; Sch-347c.

As with some other Annam pieces I have posted, I am always curious as to what the Chinese characters mean.  If a forum member would be willing to translate, I'd be appreciative.  N38.



Check this out an give me an opinion please...I just looked at some online archive photos.  I see a version of this coin, an NGC AU55 sold on Sept. 8, 2011

http://coins.ha.com/c/item.zx?saleNo=3015&lotNo=23520#68856885063

In looking at the detailed imaged of the coin, and the imperfections and toning spots, it looks like the exact same coin!  The one I just bid on is not slabbed, however.  There are two possible explanations for this similarity.  The good scenario is that the collector that bought it in 2011 didn't like slabs, so he cracked it out, and then he just now put the raw coin back up for auction.  The bad scenario is that the reason the coin looks the same is that it came from the same counterfeit die?  Since some of the similarities look like superficial black toning spots, I'm inclined to believe (hopeful?) that it is the same authentic coin (just cracked out and $4000 cheaper than 2 years ago).  But if someone thinks this is a fake, let me know ASAP, because I haven't yet gotten the auction invoice...

Offline Birdman

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #116 on: August 24, 2013, 09:39:25 AM »
The characters are simply 嗣德通寶, basically "Coin of the Realm of emperor Tu Duc". Beautiful coin, did you buy it raw or slabbed? It looks XF45 or better.

Thanks for the translation, Dragondollar.

Offline dragondollar

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #117 on: August 24, 2013, 10:52:43 AM »
Looks like the same coin to me... The pictures from Heritage are nicer though. It is not unlikely that someone broke the slab, seeing it is one of these silly oversized models.

Offline poconopenn

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #118 on: August 24, 2013, 03:15:45 PM »
Check this out an give me an opinion please...I just looked at some online archive photos.  I see a version of this coin, an NGC AU55 sold on Sept. 8, 2011

http://coins.ha.com/c/item.zx?saleNo=3015&lotNo=23520#68856885063

In looking at the detailed imaged of the coin, and the imperfections and toning spots, it looks like the exact same coin!  The one I just bid on is not slabbed, however.  There are two possible explanations for this similarity.  The good scenario is that the collector that bought it in 2011 didn't like slabs, so he cracked it out, and then he just now put the raw coin back up for auction.  The bad scenario is that the reason the coin looks the same is that it came from the same counterfeit die?  Since some of the similarities look like superficial black toning spots, I'm inclined to believe (hopeful?) that it is the same authentic coin (just cracked out and $4000 cheaper than 2 years ago).  But if someone thinks this is a fake, let me know ASAP, because I haven't yet gotten the auction invoice...

NGC website can not find this grade coin (3313779-015). This is defintely a red flag.

IMO, the coin from Stacks Bowers was produced from the same die as HA coin, but was polished on obverse to remove some lumpy marks on the rim. Based on the uncharacteristic wearness of the rim surface, in addition to the same scratch marks, IMO, both coins are fake.

Offline Hippanda

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #119 on: August 24, 2013, 04:09:42 PM »
NGC website can not find this grade coin (3313779-015). This is defintely a red flag.

IMO, the coin from Stacks Bowers was produced from the same die as HA coin, but was polished on obverse to remove some lumpy marks on the rim. Based on the uncharacteristic wearness of the rim surface, in addition to the same scratch marks, IMO, both coins are fake.

Another possibility?  The fake coin is the same one that was slabbed, it was found out to be a fake and removed from NGC database, then broken out, altered and an attempt made to sell it?

Otherwise, if this is a different coin, then counterfeiters have also mastered making fake large NGC slabs?  That would be very bad news.
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