Author Topic: Post your newest older Chinese coin  (Read 73410 times)

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Offline Birdman

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Post your newest older Chinese coin
« on: February 02, 2012, 09:06:46 PM »
In the spirit of the popular thread "Post your newest modern Chinese coin" (read over 25,000 times), I thought I'd start one focused on the Imperial/Republic coins.  I hope to learn something from other people's posts, and I'm interested to see what other collectors are finding.  I'll lead off with a coin that arrived in the mail today.

1912 China S$1 L&M-45 Y-321 NGC AU50

low

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #1 on: February 02, 2012, 10:51:12 PM »
Thanks Birdman. That is very nice coin. I hope one day I will get one too.

This one arrived few days ago. Photos from PCGS.

1920 10 cash ms64+bn Y-303

Offline aragog

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2012, 07:03:42 AM »
One of my recent

Offline Birdman

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #3 on: February 03, 2012, 09:04:51 AM »
low, that's a nice, high-grade example. I haven't had a chance yet to branch out and learn about the Chinese copper coins.  There are so many varieties, but MS condition always seems scarce.

aragog.  Wow, you are going to have to educate me on your piece.  What is it?  When was it used?  And how do you tell if something like that is authentic?

Thanks for sharing.

Offline collector1970

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #4 on: February 05, 2012, 05:29:31 AM »
Dear all,

Just one of my coins, which is a beauty I think. The first picture is a bit blurry, sorry for that.

Offline Shamota

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2012, 07:45:48 AM »
Chinese coin or Medal?
To which year does this coin?



Offline KONDi

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2012, 07:12:03 AM »
Dear Shamota,

Show me your chinese coin or medal, cause again some Russian words showed up...
Thanks in advance!

KONDi
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Offline collector1970

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CHINA-HUPEH 1895 Silver Dragon Dollar
« Reply #7 on: February 11, 2012, 12:50:58 PM »
CHINA-HUPEH 1895 Silver Dragon Dollar with "Pen Sheng" beside Dragon. Another beauty if I say so myself.

Offline happycoins II

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2012, 08:00:14 PM »
CHINA-HUPEH 1895 Silver Dragon Dollar with "Pen Sheng" beside Dragon. Another beauty if I say so myself.
Wow, I love dragon coins and so does this column. Keep posting them guys! I like to see more.
Happycoins
www.happycoins.multiply.com

Offline KONDi

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #9 on: February 16, 2012, 07:53:02 AM »
Dear collector1970,

Your CHINA-HUPEH 1895 Silver Dragon Dollar with "Pen Sheng" beside Dragon is a fake coin. I am sorry that I must tell you this. I will analyze the surface of on obverse of your coin.
First of all there are a lot of dark spots on the surface, this is not natural. I marked it on red color as also other problems with this coin.
Secondly, there is some abnormal splash on the right side close to word "Candareens" close to "S" letter.
Thirdly, all letters, especially "Candareens" word looks very crude. Not natural!
Finally, the teeth close to word "Province" are not integrated with a rim of this coin.
There are of course more traces that this is fake but it takes a lot of time to analyze it, so let's just focus on those only.
Now, your coin could be or silver-made fake with the same parameters and silver content as genuine coin or at least with the same parameters as genuine coin OR your coin is just white copper fake. I think it is just white copper fake. Please tell us diameter, thickness and weight so I will let you know which type of fake it is. Always be careful when you buy old chinese silver coins, if your coin would be genuine one it would be VERY VERY VERY RARE COIN! Remember always buy from trustful coin dealers. I would like to recomand myself. I have a lot of old chinese silver coins for sale on Buy, Sell and trade section. You are welcome to take a look and if you are interested you can contact with me.
...
Dear Happycoins,

I know you like dragon silver coins very much but let's appreciate genuine coins only.
KONDi
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Offline collector1970

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #10 on: February 16, 2012, 03:24:38 PM »
Dear Kondi,

I do respect your opinion, but I do disagree. Everything noted about my coin can be said from many other so called real coins on this forum, and it always ends with a sales pitch. Many deemed 'real' coins do have similar ‘problems’ which you have mentioned yourself.

Let’s take a look at your comments:

"First of all there are a lot of dark spots on the surface, this is not natural. I marked it on red color as also other problems with this coin. "
Such splashes can and may occur if coins are kept in a moist place, outside or even in the ground.

Let’s see what comments have been given to all the real coins found in this subject and compare:
China 1909-11 Hupeh dragon dollar silver coin with an extra dot variety?Rare?

"Secondly, there is some abnormal splash on the right side close to word "Candareens" close to "S" letter."
Look at the similar splash on this photo named: hupeh dollar-B.jpg
similar splash different place, even the Kiangnan has a big splash both deemed as real.

‘Thirdly, all letters, especially "Candareens" word looks very crude. Not natural!’

Your ten cents Kiangnan coin isn’t any better perhaps worse. How crude is that lettering and especially the number 2,  The’ I’ in the word province is not even the same size as the other letters, bearing in mind the coin presses are from a 130 years ago, silver was softer. You should know. Look at this website and find number 561. That’s a real kiangnan: http://www.baldwin.co.uk/media/cms/auction-archive/auction-hkca46/HKCA46%20Part%202%20%28Chinese%20Coins%29.pdf , see the difference with your real coin and the one on auction. The one on auction is nice and with sharp lettering.

On my coin the word candareens is almost crispier/sharper then the one from this picture: negative spin variety.jpg

“Finally, the teeth close to word "Province" are not integrated with a rim of this coin.”

Similar issues to be found on your own coin: hupeh dollar-B.jpg The teeth are not integrated with the rim, as it also looks like these teeth do not touch the rim.

I went to a professional coin grader who just lives across the street, had it tested for silver: 0.900, had it tested for weight 26.4 grams (original weight 26.7 grams) . The weight and diameter are correct.
As I said in the introduction field, I have inherited this from my grandpa who has been collecting coins his whole life. He got them from all over the world as he was a sailor. Some of them he had for at least 80 years. I have many of these beauties in my possession not all graded yet but I’m getting there.

Greetings,
Robert

Offline KONDi

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #11 on: February 16, 2012, 11:35:45 PM »
"Such splashes can and may occur if coins are kept in a moist place, outside or even in the ground."

Perhaps, but I have seen many fakes with similar dark spots, so I do not think your coin is genuine.

"Look at the similar splash on this photo named: hupeh dollar-B.jpg
similar splash different place, even the Kiangnan has a big splash both deemed as real."

This similar splash which you are talking on the photo "hupeh dollar-B" you can also find in the same place on chinese_item graded Hupeh dollar. My Kiangnan has big splash but it is genuine coin and doesn't have such of dark spots on the surface of the coin as your coin has. Also the color of my "Hupeh dollar-B" and Kiangnan coin is right. But look at your coin. The color doesn't look right on the surface of your coin.

"Your ten cents Kiangnan coin isn’t any better perhaps worse. How crude is that lettering and especially the number 2,  The’ I’ in the word province is not even the same size as the other letters, bearing in mind the coin presses are from a 130 years ago, silver was softer. You should know. Look at this website and find number 561.
see the difference with your real coin and the one on auction. The one on auction is nice and with sharp lettering."

My 10 cents Kiangnan coin maybe is not in a good condition but it is genuine. After all it is one of my coin and I know my coins very good. So please do not try here find problems with my coins.

"On my coin the word candareens is almost crispier/sharper then the one from this picture: negative spin variety.jpg"

The negative spin variety Hupeh dollar is genuine coin, so we shouldn't compare it to your silver-made fake coin.

"I went to a professional coin grader who just lives across the street, had it tested for silver: 0.900, had it tested for weight 26.4 grams (original weight 26.7 grams) . The weight and diameter are correct.
As I said in the introduction field, I have inherited this from my grandpa who has been collecting coins his whole life. He got them from all over the world as he was a sailor. Some of them he had for at least 80 years. I have many of these beauties in my possession not all graded yet but I’m getting there."

Even the coin has the same silver content "0.900" and all parameters are similar to the original weight of the coin, but the color of the surface betrays it. This is in your case. Passed down the coin from generation to another generation doesn't prove anymore that the coin is genuine one.

Dear Robert,

You might agree with my opinion about your coin or disagree. But the coin which you have in your possession in not genuine coin. My Hupeh dollar has splash and so do Kiangnan 10 cents but those are common coins. Your coin is extremely rare! For F condition you would have to spend 7500 USD for such of coin. It is so rare that I have seen it only in Shanghai Museum. Seldom you can find it in Auction Houses even. Have you seen similar splash on the other such of coin? Because I didn't. Have you seen recently such of coin for sale in auction house? I might be wrong about your coin, but I think you should send your coin to NGC to be graded. After all this is extremely rare coin and if it is genuine then you are very luck. Let us know what's the result if you will decide to grade it, but I give this coin red flag.
Maybe dragondollar can say something more about your coin.

Good luck!

KONDi
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Offline dragondollar

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2012, 06:22:59 AM »
Sorry, I agree with Kondi, both your Beiyang 22 year and 本省 dollar are fake. The calligraphy on the 22 year is totally wrong, and the details on the 本省 are also wrong. Please see the following pictures...

Here is a real 本省 dollar:

http://stacksbowers.com/auctions/AuctionLot.aspx?LotID=87800
Yours is a cast fake, as can be seen with the pimples around EENS in candareens, and the thinness of the lettering.

Here is a real Beiyang 22 year:
http://stacksbowers.com/auctions/AuctionLot.aspx?LotID=239789

Offline dragondollar

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #13 on: February 17, 2012, 06:42:30 AM »


An interesting coin... Fantasy dollar with Yuan Shi Kai as emperor Hong Xian, very nice details. However I have no idea when and where it was made... Probably in the 1930s, like most other fantasy dollars. It was graded NGC AU58.

Offline Birdman

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Re: Post your newest older Chinese coin
« Reply #14 on: February 17, 2012, 06:50:17 AM »


An interesting coin... Fantasy dollar with Yuan Shi Kai as emperor Hong Xian, very nice details. However I have no idea when and where it was made... Probably in the 1930s, like most other fantasy dollars. It was graded NGC AU58.

I've never seen that one before, Dragondollar.  Thanks for sharing.