Author Topic: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****  (Read 5390 times)

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Offline GDG's

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Offline pandamonium

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #1 on: January 24, 2012, 08:36:24 AM »
Looks like gold will take another step up in price.......

Offline Pandana

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #2 on: January 24, 2012, 11:04:57 AM »
Not sure what these will do the metal pricing, but definitely US greenback is no longer the currency for international trade.  Value of US greenback is losing ground big-time.

It's been on-going:  China has signed agreements with Japan, Russia, Pakistan, and other to trade directly in their currencies - dollars is no longer needed.

With these activities, wealth preservation is a must.  I am glad that all of us here are on the way, or in it to preserve what we have for ourselves, or for our children.

                                              WEALTH PRESERVATION MUST BE THE GOAL

tamo42

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #3 on: January 24, 2012, 11:12:47 AM »
While it is a sign that the dollar's hegemony is ending, this doesn't mean the dollar is over as the international currency. After all, it's a large part of what those other governments hold as reserves against their own currencies. If you are trading yuan, but the yuan is pegged to the dollar, you are still effectively trading dollars.

When the other central banks begin dumping dollars and treasuries on the market, then the dollar will be over as the world currency. And yes, I already know that some governments have started this.

Offline Pandana

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2012, 11:28:43 AM »

1. Banking system in the US is bankrupted, kaput. Without FED provided credit, banks in the US cannot, and does not have the capital to pay for all their poo-poo to date.
2. US has been exporting inflation. Foreign countries holding tremendous amount of US debts will at some points, buying up tangible assets - with the US dollars they have.
3. Other countries are taking measures to counter the "inflation exporting" by signing direct trade agreements to trade in their own currency or in gold: China, Japan, Pakistan and Russia, and other has done so. China has signed agreements with most middle east countries to trade oil in gold
4. FED is buying US debts; which is like one's wife is is letting the husband using the credit card
5. FED is guaranteeing Europe debts

Money supply is manipulated big time; 2 ways:
a. Physical printing - US Treasury.
b. FED manipulating credit line.

Offline PandaCollector

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #5 on: January 24, 2012, 11:43:37 AM »
At anywhere near current prices it seems doubtful to me that either India or China has enough gold reserves to buy oil from Iran for an extended period of time. In addition, I believe that most of India's gold is dispersed in the hands of private citizens, not the government, and so wouldn't be available for this trade. On top of that, what China has a surplus of is US debt, not gold. I am not surprised that this has been discussed, but it doesn't strike me as even close to practical.

Best wishes,
Peter Anthony
http://www.pandacollector.com

Offline exchange

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #6 on: January 24, 2012, 11:54:59 AM »
I saw that yesterday but coming from debka.com it should be taken with a grain of salt. debka.com has a habit of taking current events and twisting them in a way they see fit. Sometimes they guess right and sometimes they don't.

exchange

Dragons_Are_Silly

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #7 on: January 24, 2012, 12:38:18 PM »
Bwa !

"Stunning" indeed!  The gold market look stunned awright.

"unknown implications if true".

Bwa !  Wow... That silly

Who thinks this crap up?


Offline Pandana

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2012, 12:47:34 PM »
Quote from "Daily Pfennig"

EverBank World Markets
A Pfennig For Your Thoughts
Tuesday, January 24, 2012
 
.........But First, A Word From Our Sponsor..........
Announcing EverBank Wealth Management, Inc.

"....
 
Yesterday, I told you that India and Iran had signed currency swap agreements on
their trade of Oil to remove the use of U.S. dollars.  Well, then I saw a story
that said that India was going to pay Iran for their Oil in Gold.  Now, that's a
twist. and something I think the Indian Gov't will re-think going forward, that
is if it's true.
 
...
 
OK. I received quite a few notes from readers yesterday, telling me that part of
the Silver move on Friday (that I said Silver was playing catch-up with Gold)
came from the new Sprott Physical Silver Trust (PSLV) buying Silver future.
 
Ok. but I still believe that a lot of catch-up has to be made by Silver.  Silver
guru, Ted Butler, had this to say the other day, "Considering the technical
clean out we've just experienced in both gold and silver over the past few
months and the proximity of some key moving averages above current prices in
each that threaten to be penetrated, it is not hard to envision strong price
rallies. Of course, we are still discussing markets that are manipulated in
price, so we must be prepared for anything. The best preparation is not to
borrow or deploy margin."
...

Chuck Butler
President
EverBank World Markets
1-800-926-4922
1-314-647-3837

Offline badon

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #9 on: January 24, 2012, 01:18:52 PM »
It appears the West's stomping on the Middle East is backfiring full-circle.

1. The West invades several Middle Eastern countries under false pretenses.
2. Countries panic and (re)start nuclear programs.
3. North Korea tests a nuclear weapon, sinks South Korean warship, bombards South Korean island.
4. Japan gets nervous, and makes mistakes leading to multiple nuclear accidents.
5. The West's invasion of the Middle East causes Western economic peril.
6. Western civil unrest ensues, governments in jeopardy of losing power.
7. The West redirects public attention from economic hardship by threatening more Middle East invasions.
8. Countries panic and ally for expanded nuclear programs.
9. The West incites revolts in the Middle East.
10. Countries panic and ally militarily with conventional forces (Russia, Syria, Iran, India, etc).
11. American navy postures for war off the coast of Iran.
12. The West threatens Iran's economy.
13. Countries panic, military strategists begin planning to repel invasion by the West.
14. Countries panic, start moving away from the U.S. dollar.
15. (future) Western economy dives deeper into poverty.
16. (future) Western civil unrest increases
17. (future) Western mass-imprisonment of its people increases.
18. (future) The West presses for war to unite discontent people behind bad government.
19. (future) ?
20. (future) ?

Offline SANDAC

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #10 on: January 24, 2012, 01:30:41 PM »
IMO, it is a pretty good move for India and China to pay oil with gold.  The oil price in term of gold is pretty stable.  

China and India are accumulating gold.  There are not nearly enough gold at current price to pay for oil, but as oil-for-gold becomes accepted, the demand on gold will drive its price up much faster than oil price, so the oil price will fall relative to gold.  Countries with big hoard of gold will benefit with this, which presumably include the US.

Offline SANDAC

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #11 on: January 24, 2012, 01:40:05 PM »
Oops, wrong chart.  It looks like price of oil in gold is no more stable than dollar, but I still say gold is scarce in term of oil, whereas dollar is abundant, so paying oil with gold is a good idea for countries with big reserve of gold.

Underbidder

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #12 on: January 24, 2012, 04:16:31 PM »
.. so paying oil with gold is a good idea for countries with big reserve of gold.

So... how does getting rid of something getting scarcer and increasing in value, as opposed to bailing out first of something being printed without limit and getting worthless, make sense again?

Gordon Brown Economics?   

Offline badon

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #13 on: January 24, 2012, 05:04:38 PM »
I think SANDAC means it's good for the country receiving the gold, and maybe good for countries that don't have and don't want USD's to use for making purchases. Gresham's law is always in effect, and this case is an unusual situation where the currency is so undesirable that it becomes unacceptable.

Underbidder

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #14 on: January 24, 2012, 05:41:43 PM »
Libya had oil, gold, and was looking to get away from the USD and into gold to settle oil sales.
How did that work out for them?  They were invaded by Europe and the US and their gold and oil were divvied up.

Having more gold, will not protect Iran. If anything, it dooms it all the more.
« Last Edit: January 24, 2012, 05:49:05 PM by Underbidder »

Offline badon

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #15 on: January 24, 2012, 06:23:44 PM »
Iran is the militarily strongest middle eastern nation, after Israel. They defeated an American-backed invasion by Iraq after 8 years of non-stop fighting. I doubt any invader could hold anything in Iran if the Iranians opposed it. Afghanistan is a pile of rocks compared to Iran, and they beat the Russians, and soon they will have beaten the Westerners too.

It's amazing how feckless missiles and helicopters are against angry locals. The last time that region was conquered was by Genghis Khan around 800 years ago, and he decided the only way he could hold the territory was by exterminating everyone living in it. The West has put itself on a path toward humiliating defeat (and then peace), or committing genocide. If it's going to be a genocide, it's probably going to be worse than anything we've ever seen before, in East AND the West.

Nobody trusts America anymore, and its allies in the West are wavering. In contrast, the East is unifying in opposition to the West, even if they disagree about everything else. I don't think the West can win in the Middle East, and the spoils of Libya are temporary, just like "Mission Accomplished" was in Iraq.

I think everybody is hoping America stops escalating before somebody gets a twitchy trigger finger, and things get out of hand. Iran is nearly as brutal as America, and they have the technology and alliances to make sure any conflict is very nasty.

Behind the scenes of all this talk about oil and EFP's and IED's, the East and West have been upgrading their nuclear capabilities. It's hard to believe that a war in Iran would not go nuclear within a few hours of the beginning of an overt invasion.

Iran has some cards to play that the West does not know about yet. As an example, one of them has already been played when they stole one of America's stealth drones. They hack an elite-level cryptographically secure communication network to gain control over it and fly it to one of their own airbases. It's clear proof the Iranians are not technological nitwits like some of their neighbors.

Now that Iran has a complete example of America's best stealth technology, it won't be long before it is reverse engineered, and American invaders will have to do battle with an adversary that doesn't need to hide in caves anymore. Iran is far from doomed. All it would take is a refit of the stealth drone they captured, and they would have the capability to fly a nuclear weapon into the United States or Europe with a realistic probability that it would reach its target before being intercepted.

There's a carrier battle group off the shores of Iran right now. It could get vaporized. America loans nuclear weapons to Israel, and it is conceivable that Russia, Pakistan, India, China, or North Korea could loan nuclear weapons to Iran.

No one outside the West wants the region to be secured by the American military - not even the American people want that. None of America's advantages look even remotely capable of sustaining anything more than a temporary incursion into Iran. As powerful as America is militarily, it's not more powerful versus the rest of the world than Germany was in the 1930's.

If invading Iraq and Afghanistan was a folly of epic proportions, then invading Iran would be something new altogether. All of the cold war nightmares would be resurrected in a flash of incinerating light.

Underbidder

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #16 on: January 24, 2012, 07:27:31 PM »
With all the highly illegal assasinations, and computer virus slowing the progress of the Iranian nuclear effort, I have to think once again, like Libya, it is a globally sanctioned effort.
After all, Europe, The US, and gasp.. China...all benefitted from the Libya takeover.  I see China as being involved in Iran too.  
More oil will flow to all, under a "settled" ME.

The drone?  I'm surprised nobody has mentioned, with the history right there, of the possibility of It being a Trojan Horse.

The US is losing influence and power, but in some ways, is still far ahead of the rest of the globe in matters of war and intrigue.

« Last Edit: January 24, 2012, 07:40:14 PM by Underbidder »

Offline badon

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #17 on: January 24, 2012, 07:36:03 PM »
The drone?  I'm surprised nobody has mentioned, with the history right there, of the possibility of It being a Trojan Horse.

The US is losing influence and power, but in some ways, is still far ahead of the rest of the globe in matters of war and intrigue.

The plot thickens!

Offline dobedo

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #18 on: January 24, 2012, 07:52:05 PM »
"In Gold We Trust" - Welcome to Utah! We trust silver, too.

Offline ghostrider80811

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #19 on: January 25, 2012, 12:32:02 AM »
With all the highly illegal assasinations, and computer virus slowing the progress of the Iranian nuclear effort, I have to think once again, like Libya, it is a globally sanctioned effort.
After all, Europe, The US, and gasp.. China...all benefitted from the Libya takeover.  I see China as being involved in Iran too.  
More oil will flow to all, under a "settled" ME.

The drone?  I'm surprised nobody has mentioned, with the history right there, of the possibility of It being a Trojan Horse.

The US is losing influence and power, but in some ways, is still far ahead of the rest of the globe in matters of war and intrigue.



Im watching the Iran development very carefully since this will directly impact all of us and interesting perspective on the Trojan House too.  
« Last Edit: January 25, 2012, 12:50:36 AM by ghostrider80811 »

Offline ghostrider80811

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #20 on: January 25, 2012, 12:36:42 AM »
"In Gold We Trust" - Welcome to Utah! We trust silver, too.

Too bad one can only use Gold/Silver ASE in Utah and nothing else. 

Offline ghostrider80811

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #21 on: January 25, 2012, 12:51:04 AM »

Im watching the Iran development very carefully since this will directly impact all of us and interesting perspective on the Trojan Horse too.  

Offline ghostrider80811

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #22 on: January 25, 2012, 12:52:12 AM »
Mods-Can you delete this one post?  thanks as I tried fixing some of my spelling but it didnt come out right, thanks! 

Offline badon

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #23 on: January 25, 2012, 04:57:05 PM »
It's OK, we know what you're trying to say.

About the Trojan Horse theory, I disagree. There is no reason to believe such a thing had occurred, and it is difficult to theorize how it could even be possible. Besides, there are much cheaper, simpler, and more expedient ways to do that kind of thing. The idea would be great for a spy novel though!

Offline pandamonium

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #24 on: January 25, 2012, 06:20:51 PM »
You are right, Iran is the key for now.  They can raise the price of oil, gold/silver w/o a shot being fired, yet.  (Today the rise in metals was credited to the Fed's comments)  Selling oil for gold is bad news.  I read articles a few years ago on how to collapse the US dollar or petrol dollar.  It said the oil producers will demand gold for oil.  (How much oil for how much gold?) That is the beginning of the end.  Not to sound too negative but we all know this could get real serious real fast.  Hopefully it will be just more threats and negotiations in the mid East.  Most all signs point to rise in metals prices whichever way the situation works out...........

Underbidder

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Re: *****Stunning Gold Development with unknown implications if true*****
« Reply #25 on: January 25, 2012, 06:30:43 PM »
It's OK, we know what you're trying to say.

About the Trojan Horse theory, I disagree. There is no reason to believe such a thing had occurred, and it is difficult to theorize how it could even be possible. Besides, there are much cheaper, simpler, and more expedient ways to do that kind of thing. The idea would be great for a spy novel though!

Right. So the drone landed itself nicely, or the Iranians hacked into and somehow skillfully flew it down intact.
Slightly possib-le, but not probab-le.  ;)

Oh, and they danced and danced, when they saw how skillfully they beat the "Great" Satan.
So did the residents of Troy.

(They don't call it " Great" for nuttin' !)

The Stuxnet computer virus dissabled Iranian nuclear program:

http://www.foxnews.com/scitech/2010/11/26/secret-agent-crippled-irans-nuclear-ambitions/

http://blog.thesecuritydialogue.org/2011/12/lost-uav-or-trojan-horse.html
« Last Edit: January 25, 2012, 06:47:15 PM by Underbidder »