Author Topic: China 1897 Anhwei dragon dollar silver coin and what is it worth?Let me know  (Read 13813 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline chinese_item

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 153
  • Karma: -60
Hi to all the member in this forum once again.I have a piece of china 1897 Anhwei dragon dollar silver coin from my personal chinese coin collection and this coin is in an extra fine condition from my overview.Beside that,there are a few letters beside each chinese word on obverse side and I only can see this letters appeared on this coin but not other of my chinese dragon dollar coins for sure.May I know what are all of this letters about and what is this coin worth currently?Another thing is if this is a rare or common coin in the market because I have never seen this coin put up for sale on ebay before and also on other websites except the 1898 piece which is very commonly seen for sale on the websites for sure.Is this a genuine piece?I really have no idea at all if this is a genuine piece or not because I am not a chinese coin expert at all and hope someone can let me know about it.


Hopefully people like dragondollar and kondi can help me and answer my questions on above.Your help is always apprieiciated from me and I will get back to you as soon as possible after your reply over here.Please refer to the scans below and let me know what you think of it.Thank you.




Offline manymore

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 34
  • Karma: 6
    • Ancient Chinese Charms and Coins
This coin only exists as a "pattern" coin which was struck in 1897 when Anhui Province was considering buying equipment to mint silver coins from a German manufacturer.

The English letters "A.T.S.C." are the abbreviation for "Anhwei", "Taching" (Great Ch'ing), "Silver", "Coin".

As you might guess, these pattern coins are extremely rare and would probably sell for US$1,000,000 or more if one were to come up for auction.

Your coin clearly lacks the qualities of being a finely-struck pattern coin and its worth, unfortunately, is only that of a reproduction or "fake".

Gary

Offline chinese_item

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 153
  • Karma: -60
Hi many more,


              Thank you very much for your replied with your comment.First of all,are you sure that this Anhui coin is considered as extremely rare and would probably sell for more than USD1,000,000 if one were to come up for auction?I never know anything about that and my thought that this coin is just considered as rare piece if it is a genuine piece for sure.Beside that,my thought was most of the chinese dragon dollar coins are considered as extremely just before 1897,the period within 1889 to 1896 as listed in my chinese dragon dollar catalogue but never seen this coin ever sold or worthed so much listed in my catalogue for sure. :biggrin:

Your sound like you are a chinese dragon dollar coin expert who can identify that this coin is completely a fake piece from the scans that I have provided here and hopefully what you have just said is not true.Does anyone over here agree with me or agree with him?Please let me know with your reply from other member here.

Offline KONDi

  • Trade Count: (+6)
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2844
  • Karma: 59
  • Gender: Male
Dear chinese_item,

I must agree with Gary at this point. This is silver-made coin but not genuine one! I am sorry but this what he is saying is truth :crying:
I will give me head to be cut off by saying this coin is silver-made fake. I have never seen anywhere this coin. It is extremely rare coin. I could worth much more than 1,000,000 USD right now. In my life I had Anhwei dollar 1898 in my hands and I sold it for high price. Now I don't have any Anhwei dollars, those from 1898 cause they are also rare. Well not like Anhwei dollar 1897 A.T.S.C. but also rare ones.
I found only 2 pictures of genuine Anhwei dollar 1897 A.T.S.C. One is not so clear, the other is little better. I will back to you tomorrow with detail explanations why I think your Anhwei dollar is silver-made fake. Today is too late and I have to go sleep. I marked those problems which I will explain tomorrow on red circles. I will back to you tomorrow.
KONDi
cfrost1984@gmail.com
Chopmark Collectors Club member 368 (CCC)
Shanghai Token Society member 3 (STS)

Offline KONDi

  • Trade Count: (+6)
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2844
  • Karma: 59
  • Gender: Male
Ok I am backing to you now. Your Anhwei dollar is silver-made fake like I said. I didn't have genuine piece even once in my hand but there are some traces on the surface of your coin that speaks for themselves. First of all on obverse there are some inner dots, which are made not during mechanical use or circulation only during producing process of this coin. This is not normal, on genuine coin there shouldn't be such of pitting on the surface. Also some teeth are not connected with a rim-this is not natural also.
Now let's take a look on reverse of your coin. There some dark circles or dots on the surface. I saw similar ones on other silver-made fakes. There are also some small dots on the surface----pitting in a group.Some chinese characters on reverse have extra elevation and small hills which also doesn't look good. I compared the reverse with that better quality Anhwei dollar 1897 and didn't find those elevation. And finally teeth on left side on reverse have different shape than others.
Those all evidence can say that this is not genuine coin. I am sorry to tell you this, but this is not genuine coin. This is my opinion. Maybe dragondollar can add something else about this coin.
KONDi
cfrost1984@gmail.com
Chopmark Collectors Club member 368 (CCC)
Shanghai Token Society member 3 (STS)

Offline chinese_item

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 153
  • Karma: -60
Ok I am backing to you now. Your Anhwei dollar is silver-made fake like I said. I didn't have genuine piece even once in my hand but there are some traces on the surface of your coin that speaks for themselves. First of all on obverse there are some inner dots, which are made not during mechanical use or circulation only during producing process of this coin. This is not normal, on genuine coin there shouldn't be such of pitting on the surface. Also some teeth are not connected with a rim-this is not natural also.
Now let's take a look on reverse of your coin. There some dark circles or dots on the surface. I saw similar ones on other silver-made fakes. There are also some small dots on the surface----pitting in a group.Some chinese characters on reverse have extra elevation and small hills which also doesn't look good. I compared the reverse with that better quality Anhwei dollar 1897 and didn't find those elevation. And finally teeth on left side on reverse have different shape than others.
Those all evidence can say that this is not genuine coin. I am sorry to tell you this, but this is not genuine coin. This is my opinion. Maybe dragondollar can add something else about this coin.


Hi,kondi


         Thank you very much for your personal opinion and comment about this coin and I would have to fully agree with you that probably this is not a genuine piece after you made everything clear in detail on above.Like what I have mentioned before  that I am not a chinese dragon dollar coin expert at all like you and dragondollar,maybe manymore is better than me and I have to agree with him right now that this coin is an extremely rare piece and really worth so much but this coin is not considered extrmely rare and ever sold for as much as the piece that he mentioned in my chinese coin catalogue to be honest.


By the way,this is the last coin without any grading coin company holder that I have bought because that I am afraid to buy any fake coin from now onward.That is why I will buy any chinese dragon dollar silver coin with a holder start from now for sure.The goodnews is that I have just bought a chinese dragon dollar silver coin with a ngc holder and it has an extra dot on the obverse side and I will show it to you over here by a new topic on tomorrow.Please check it out and let me know what you think of it.


I apprieiciate your comment and help very much and luckily you let me know that this coin is not a genuine piece and showed me everything in detail.Otherwise,I will always think that this is a genuine coin and remain for the rest of my life.



Thank you and see you again.

Offline chinese_item

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 153
  • Karma: -60
Hi,kondi


         I am going to post another chinese dragon dollar silver coin with a new topic in this forum.This time the coin is with NGC holder and I am sure it is a genuine coin right now for sure.Beside that,it has an extra dot on obverse side of the coin.Please check it out and let me know what you think.Please give me your personal opinion and comment.Thank you.

Offline KONDi

  • Trade Count: (+6)
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 2844
  • Karma: 59
  • Gender: Male
You are always welcome!:)
I am happy to help you. I hope this is not your last coin without any grading coin company holder which you bought. Hey! I have a lot of interesting and valuable varieties of Republican and Qing dynasty old silver coins. They are not graded by NGC or PCGS but genuine pieces. If you will buy from me some old chinese coin you won't be disappointed. I have good coins with history on them. Please check Buy, Sell and Trade section. I post there every month "Old chinese silver coins for sale..." about 10 coins. Maybe you will find something interesting. I answered you about that Hupeh dollar 1909-11 with extra dot. It is dot on pearl variety if it has a dot on pearl on obverse. You have to post there more clear photo of obverse.
KONDi
cfrost1984@gmail.com
Chopmark Collectors Club member 368 (CCC)
Shanghai Token Society member 3 (STS)

Offline tkcoin

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 87
  • Karma: 2
This is a cast made coin, typical of your father's generation type of fake.
Nowadays, there are cutting edge "Highly Similar" silver made fakes.

Offline linlaujiou

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 83
  • Karma: 0
 N16

Offline linlaujiou

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 83
  • Karma: 0
 N28

Offline linlaujiou

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 83
  • Karma: 0
1927中華民國國民政府十六年造...孫中山陵墓幣.....機制特徵分享 N30

境外論壇首發....敬告機制幣同好....撿漏當撿如此漏 N34

Offline linlaujiou

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 83
  • Karma: 0
 N28有圖自有真相.
ACCA亞洲錢幣鑑定中心簡任賢先生兩週前對我說錢幣只需用4到10倍放大倍率檢視.且否定樣幣存在暗記.
我個人還是習慣用60倍放大倍率伺候 N4
當初造幣鋼模是1比1比例以人工刻鑿而成.鋼模反擊幣面留下刻鑿刀口的蛛絲馬跡就是機制特徵的直接證據.
試問要檢視幣面刻鑿痕跡該用幾倍放大倍率?  N16