Author Topic: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion  (Read 19568 times)

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Offline pandamonium

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Re: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion
« Reply #45 on: October 18, 2013, 09:46:09 PM »
Will rare US coins hold their value?   With a $17 trillion dollar debt and growing, this is making the dollar unwanted worldwide.  If the US dollar is losing its value will that hurt the US rare coin market?  I don't know.  As the Chinese accumulate gold to back the Yuan, will that make MCC more valuable?.........

Offline pandamonium

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Offline davidt3251

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Re: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion
« Reply #47 on: October 19, 2013, 12:46:30 AM »
So lets see, in little over two months the Debt to GDP ratio went from 105% to 107%, and shortly will be at  $17,000,000,000,000.00 in debt. While at the same time gold drops from something like $1650 to below $1400.....

exchange


Gold is hard to store, and with confiscation of gold on people's mnind in the wake of Cyprus bank bailins, T-Bill volatility around the debt ceiling, Poland pension debt bailins, and Chase wire controls, its obvious that the only place 'they' want us to put our money is in the stock market. At this point its a 'hold your nose and buy' trade. One day it will fall apart but not yet apparently.

Online Birdman

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Re: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion
« Reply #48 on: October 19, 2013, 08:06:16 AM »
The US debt increased by $328,000,000,000.00 in ONE DAY on Thursday.

"U.S. debt jumps a record $328 billion — tops $17 trillion for first time"

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/oct/18/us-debt-jumps-400-billion-tops-17-trillion-first-t/?utm_source=RSS_Feed&utm_medium=RSS


Online Birdman

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Re: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion
« Reply #49 on: January 12, 2014, 06:15:32 PM »
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/01/10/usa-fed-earnings-idUSL2N0KK18F20140110

The Federal Reserve now holds $2,200,000,000,000.00 in US Treasury debt, which is 12.7% of the US Federal Government's $17.3 trillion dollar debt....I knew the US Fed was printing money to buy some US debt, but that is a huge (and growing) portion.  This increasingly strikes me as unsustainable, smoke-and-mirrors shuffling of finances. 

I feel good owning some gold pandas.

Offline Hippanda

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Re: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion
« Reply #50 on: January 12, 2014, 06:51:49 PM »
http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/01/10/usa-fed-earnings-idUSL2N0KK18F20140110

 This increasingly strikes me as unsustainable, smoke-and-mirrors shuffling of finances.  


It's beginning to look as if they can keep the smoke-and-mirrors, or Three Card Monte/ Shell Game shuffling, going much longer than we thought.  What keeps that 12.7% from going to 20, 30, 70 or all?
After all, they can just keep conjuring FDRs (aka printing) ie keep bringing in new peas or new cards into the deck. As long as they force use of US  "Dollar" Federal Reserve Notes by the barrel of a gun (literally) for both domestic tax payment and foreign oil payment, and importantly THERE IS NO SUBSTITUTE, this can go on indefinitely.  They have already (shall we say discouraged?) alternative payment systems via knocking down Liberty Dollars and now its looks like they'll limit Bitcoins and knock them down too as an alternate currency.  Like its joked: Why does rhe government imprison counterfeitors? 'Cuz they hate the competition!
Foreign currencies? give me a break - they won't allow that.
Can even precious metals hold up under such tyrany?  We'll see when we see what's left after new higher taxes. Black market? That door is closing.  Electronic surveillance of all financial transactions will insure interpretation of gains in their favor. How about 95% tax on gain, and they define gains?  The Controllers will change the laws of the game in their favor.  They will have the game rigged, and other "players" will likely be unkowing accomplices, like in any Con game. Try to move it out of the country, like the stories we hear about refugees from Europe and Vietnam
taking their wealth out in gold and diamonds sewn in the linings of their coats?  Forget about it now with TSA and
freight scanners.  Middlemen? Not in a small world, they'd likely take your stash, then rat you out.

I like my pandas but more and more am looking for a solution that holds earning power that cant be taxed away. Those are fewer and fewer and maybe the door will soon close or has closed already to "none".

1984 is here.
"He who speaks without modesty will find it difficult to make his words good."

Confucius

Online Birdman

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Re: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion
« Reply #51 on: January 12, 2014, 06:56:39 PM »
I like my pandas but more and more am looking for a solution that holds earning power that cant be taxed away.

What currently fits that description in your mind?

Offline Hippanda

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Re: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion
« Reply #52 on: January 12, 2014, 07:09:32 PM »
Too few situations that few, if any, would tolerate. Would you still feel you had any Liberty left, at 60% taxes? 70? 80? 90? Or feel like a slave/ prisoner?

Own a home in a state or county without property taxes, but they would probably change that and impose new taxes.

Live in an RV?  No, there would be licensing, registration fees, gas taxes,  in short they would own you.

Grow your own food ?, but be ready for them to outlaw that too (for "health reasons" ya see). No backyard chickens, no gardens, no no no..      ..its happening.

Have a skill that's barterable ? but then expect to be ratted out, audited, threatened by imprisonment if you dont convert those bartered eggs into equivalent value FRNs and pay what they say.

More and more will find living on the dole, or imprisoned, as the better alternative. The US is well on the way. Imagine
80% of the population that way, 50% unemployed and the majority of the rest working for the government in the security, welfare, or prison business. Just need to keep the printing machine on 24/7 and a growing military and a growing police and TSA force to keep it all going...and throw the Constitution away as "they" have directed the courts to ignore it. The top "elected" (?) officials find it inconvenient to their plans so they tell us its meant to be a "living document" and changed/ "modernized" to fit their agenda, (not ours)

Thinking of an acquaintance who was "off the grid" : single contractor working for cash. Owned (by) no home. Slept in car, showered in city parks. He felt he was a free man.  He got older and tired. Now he's owned by a home, taxes taken from him. He feels he's a slave. He's done.

Petty criminals have the odds in their favor: if they dont get caught, they get by ok. If they do get caught, they more often get released.. When they get caught enough times, for a while they have a decent state-funded rest with TV, sports, solid food, comfortable living arrangements, in short a brief hotel stay. Sounds better and better to more and more.

We are already here - nobody notices the fences yet that's all (below)
« Last Edit: January 12, 2014, 07:39:48 PM by Hippanda »
"He who speaks without modesty will find it difficult to make his words good."

Confucius

Offline GDG's

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Re: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion
« Reply #53 on: January 12, 2014, 08:00:21 PM »
One nuclear event, emp pulse, fried electronic grid, and presto living like they did 200 years ago without the know how to survive. BUT, new currency and no more debt. Of course the population would be shrunk a good 75%+. Perhaps it's time to take those sailing lessons and buy that big sailboat.

Offline Hippanda

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Re: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion
« Reply #54 on: January 12, 2014, 08:37:57 PM »
In such scenarios, anybody without a boat would be in for tough times, agreed.

And I also agree there would be a large loss of population and endless violence, as nobody has the skills anymore nor the resources to be self-sufficient. And even if you did, forget about the police being able to help you protect it. They cant even help protect you now, they just write reports after the crime has already happened.

Things have changed.  Even if there are no EMPs, nuclear events, or worldwide market crashes, the time where one could wait for things to "settle down" and walk in afterwards somewhere with a stack of gold to cash in at a good rate in a new currency may be prohibited by a malevolent restrictive  government.
They will ensure only govt cronies get out of it well.
Now there is getting to be really no way to protect, and nowhere to flee with one's stash.
"He who speaks without modesty will find it difficult to make his words good."

Confucius

Offline pandamonium

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Re: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion
« Reply #55 on: January 12, 2014, 09:22:30 PM »
Bullion will be released at some point and we will see the parabolic spike in price.   That cannot be stopped as China will soon control the bullion price not the West.   We should all be looking at homes overseas or the Southern Hemisphere.  Most countries will want a FBI report on each family member and do not forget your passport.   Food supplies too.  When bullion goes up so will MCC and the world will want payment in a gold backed Yuan not US dollar.   MCC are the best of Chinese money so we will have buying power.  Just take the necessary steps today.  For example i like Chile alot but it has 3 or 4 continental plate fault lines.   If we have the ability to buy and are willing to help the locals of our new country then we should do just fine as the rest of the population here will learn to deal w/ a impossible situation.......

Offline Hippanda

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Re: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion
« Reply #56 on: January 12, 2014, 10:56:09 PM »
Since you like to think out future scenarios, you might want to think of alternative endings, other than the one you are expecting, to be prepared, ya know, "just in case".  ;)

TPTB, after all, can be expected, to do the unexpected.
"He who speaks without modesty will find it difficult to make his words good."

Confucius

Online Birdman

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Re: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion
« Reply #57 on: December 03, 2014, 07:36:23 AM »
Another milestone:  $18,000,000,000,000.00

http://www.usdebtclock.org/


Offline GDG's

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Re: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion
« Reply #58 on: December 03, 2014, 04:30:04 PM »
Another milestone:  $18,000,000,000,000.00

http://www.usdebtclock.org/


Check the unfunded liabilities for Social Security, Medicare and Medicare prescription drug program for the real shocker. Baby Boomers can kiss their SS bye bye.

Online Birdman

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Re: Its official, National Debt is now $15 Trillion
« Reply #59 on: November 05, 2015, 11:20:29 AM »
Just crossed $18,500,000,000,000.00.

http://www.usdebtclock.org/

This thread was started almost exactly four years ago in November 2011.  The US debt has increased 3,500,000,000,000.00 since then.  And within the past week or so the US worked out the political details to raise the debt ceiling until 2017?

And while all this has happened the US dollar index has pushed higher and higher.  Fascinating how the higher our debt is the stronger our currency is, at least for the moment.