Author Topic: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...  (Read 77439 times)

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Offline KONDi

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Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« on: November 09, 2011, 01:34:35 AM »
Dear coin collectors and coin dealers,

Today I would like to share with information about my research on common fatman dollar 1914. Every more experienced collector knows that YSK 1914 it is common coin. But now every one knows that there are some rare variety of YSK dollar dated 1914. So this what I am going to share with you right now. So have a sit comfortable in your arm chair take a cup of coffee if you will ready this late a night and enjoy readying:)

picture 1.
This YSK fatman dollar when we take a look on the obverse was issued in 1914 according to the date on the coin. However according to some information which I found this coin with mint mark "O"(letter "O") in a ribbon knot was very rare coin till 1980, after 1980's many of the came up on the market. Even that it is still rare then common fatman 1914. Some information also said that it was issued between 1948-49 and later got out of circulation. Mint mark with letter "O" according to other information which I have indicates Tianjin Central Mint. But I can't confirm it. This is just my speculation. Except different not connected part of chinese character "yuan", mint mark "O" and longer grain of a leaf of the right side of the reverse. This coin has double ear. This variety called double ear YSK 1914 with mint mark "O". Rare.

picture 2.
This one is our common YSK 1914 dollar.

picture 3.
Gansu (Kansu) variety of YSK 1914. According to: http://home.netvigator.com/~ykleungn/yuansk3.htm
This coin was issued in 1921 or later and it was circulated at a discount in the Republic period,cause it has low silver content (about 60-70% content of silver). I also found some other information that it was issued in 1930's. It is hard to say when exactly. But this one is rarer than common YSK 1914
dollar on picture 2 for sure. It has double eyebrow, bigger head, different shape of chinese characters on the obverse when you will compare them to the one on picture 2. The shape of that part with stars is also different. One the reverse 2 chinese character "yi yuan" are also in a different shape. Leaves are little more clear than on common fatman 1914 from the picture nr 2.

picture 4.
People from Gansu (Kansu) variety of YSK 1914. On the obverse all chinese characters looks more thiner then on picture 3. If you take a look closer you can even say that they are crude. Teeth on the obverse also looks like they are made in crude way. Hair are more visuable than on the one from picture 3. The part wit stars also look thiner and more clear. On the reverse 2 chinese characters "yi yuan" looks similar to the one on picture 3. Very rare!

picture 5.
Wuchang is a city in China. This variety which I would like to show you on picture nr 5 if from Wuchang. On the obverse the 3rd chinese character has small part which is shorter than on common YSK 1914 from picture 2. Also a part of the ribbon on the reverse on the left side has like 2 branches. Those 2 things are characteristic for Wuchang variety of YSK 1914. But what else? Well as you can notice, Wuchang variety has fatter rim: 39.5mm in diameter. Rare.

picture 6.
Hook variety of YSK 1914 dollar. This one is a rare type thanks to the hook, which is located on the reverse on the right side close to the center ribbon.


picture 7.
The rarest variety with all YSK dollars 1914 is Shandong. It was issued in Shandong province by warlord. This variety is much rarer than Xinjiang variety. The shape of eyes is characteristic, hair, which looks like Yuan has little less hair. The part with stars is also in different shape. Very characteristic thing for Shandong variety is 2nd chinese character "yuan". This is the rarest variety among all YSK 1914 dollars. Very very rare type.

picture 8.
On the reverse of this variety of YSK dollar 1914 we can see that 2 grains od leaves downstairs are crossed. This variety called crossed grains variety of YSK 1914. Rare.

picture 9.
YSK dollar 1914 with mint mark "O". This variety has a part of second character "yuan" not connected on the reverse. Mustache on the obverse are not so clear as we as the part of Yuan's uniform. Eyes look like calm but clear. Teeth on the left side of the obverse look like they would have small balls shape. This variety called not connected "yuan" character of YSK 1914 with mith mark "O". It also has longer granis on the reverse on the right side. Rare type.

picture 10.
Xinjiang (Sinkiang) variety of YSK dollar 1914. I was made in Xinjiang province. Some information says that there are north and south varieties from Xinjiang. All Xinjiang varieties has from 26,7g-27,2g weight, diameter is 39,5mm. Silver content: 40-50%. They are all made in crude way. This one has not clear part with stars and characteristic eye's shape on the obverse. On the reverse it has close first
chinese character "yi" one leaf is crossed with long grain. Also on the right side on the character "yuan" there are 3-4 grains. But this is what I see is actually 5 granis on the right side on character "yuan", one is hidden in another. Rare type, much more rarer than Gansu variety on picture 3. It was issued by warlord.

picture 11.
The 3rd variety of "O" mint mark YSK 1914. This one has more clear mustache on the obverse, different way of look (eye looks different) then on picture 9. The part of Yuan's uniform is more clear than on the one from picture 9. The part with stars is also clear but only stars I think. On the reverse leaves are more clear, a part of character "yuan" is connected and creats triangular shape. Letter "O", the mint mark is not so clear as on picture 9. The grain on the right side one of leaf is longer than on the one from picture 9.Rare type.

picture 12.
This is Tibet variety, a restrike made in 1950's by chinese communists. They were all made in Szechuan province to pay workers for building the road in Tibet. On the obverse stars part is very clear teeth upstairs are very small and not so easy to notice. Other parts like hair, eye and mustache are also not clear. The part in 1st chinese character is much thiner than on the one from picture 2. On the reverse second chinese character "yuan" is connected creats traingular shape and leaves are more clear. There are 2 varieties of this YSK 1914 Tibet restrike. Rare then common YSK 1914 on picture 2.

picture 13.
Double pen variety of YSK 1914. On the obverse of this one we can notice that 4th chinese character has like 2 lines inside missing or not co clear when you look on it for a first time. When you will take a look closer you can see that first line is divided on 2 which looks like a pen and the second one also but it is not so clear as the first line. One the reverse the second chinese character "yuan" is thiner then on YSK 1914 on picture 2. Double pen variety is rarer than common YSK 1914 on picture 2.

picture 14.
The reverse of this variety of YSK 1914 has 1 grain of one leaf which is more clear on the right side. Also a fundamental part of character "yuan" is thiner than on the one on picture 2. Rare.

picture 15.
Bold variety of YSK 1914 from Gansu province. This one looks similar to the one on picture nr 3. However when we will take a look closer we can notice that all 6 characters on obverse are bold. Rarer than Gansu variety 1914 on picture 3, but not so rare as People from Gansu variety on picture 4.

picture 16.
This variety of YSK 1914 is very interesting. It looks similar to year 8 (1919) of fatman dollar. I mean some part like the part with stars, hair, shape of eye. But when I took a look on all my YSK 1919 which I have for sale I didn't find even one which has a part of 3rd character is the same shape of hook and the last chinese character in a bow shape. I think it is very interesting and rare variety of YSK 1914. Rare for sure.

picture 17.
Yunnan variety of YSK dollar 1914. All 6 chinese characters looks different than those on YSK 1914 from picture 2. The bust of Yuan is not clear. The teeth are little smaller on the obverse. 2 chinese characters "yi yuan" are both bold.Very rare.

picture 18a and 18b
Those are both varieties of YSK 1914 from Xinjiang province. They are both different. On the obverse of 18a 1st character is bigger than on the one from picture 18b. Eyes are in different shape. Nose from 18a on obverse is longer but nose on 18b on obverse is the same size with mustache. The part with stars is more clear on 18b than on 18a on obverse. The 4th chinese character on 18a on obverse is shorter but on 18b is taller. On reverse of both, 18a has 3 grains on the right side of the character "yuan" and on 18b there are 4 grains. on 18a a part of the character "yi" has small hook and the left side of character "yuan" is moved a little bit to inside. Those 2 character are different from the Xinjiang variety of picture 10. Both are rarer than Gansu variety on picture 3.

picture 19.
This is private variety, probably made by some less known warlord. It has 26,5g weight. On the obverse you can notice that shape all 6 characters are different than on the one from picture 2. Also shape of eye is different. On the reverse both characters, especially character "yuan" has different shape. Rare and interesting!

picture 20.
This is also private variety, but made by other warlord. Shape of eye is different than on picture 19. All 6 chinese characters looks different than on the one from picture 19. Ear is in different shape and stars part. It has also some line which goes behind Yuan's head. On the reverse leaves and 2 chinese characters are made in crude way. Rare and also interesting. This one has also 26,5g of weight.

picture 21.
On the reverse of this variety of YSK 1914 we can see that on the right side. One grain of a leaf is crossed with another leaf. Rare type.

picture 22.
Another private variety which was made by warlord probably. Crude made all 6 chinese characters on obverse. Eye is not clear and also part with stars. The part with stars is also the smallest with all varieties of YSK 1914 dollar. On the reverse hair are made in crude way not so clear as well as 2
chinese characters. Rare. It has 26,7g weight, silver content 8,5%.

picture 23.
This is my favorite private variety of YSK 1914. It has northwest style and it is overweight,has 28,5g weight and only 8% of silver content. It has different shape of ear, eye. All chinese characters on obverse are made in crude way. Teeth on right side and also downstairs are in some distance from the rim of the coin. On the reverse leaves are clear and 2 chinese characters are made in crude way. Beautiful and the only one so far I saw and own.

picture 24.
Another one private variety. Look on the shape of all 6 chinese characters on obverse, especially 6th one. Ear is bigger, much bigger. Eye shape it is like Yuan is very old, which makes me think it was made after his death, after 1916. The part with stars very clear. Leaves on reverse and 2 chinese characters are not so clear. Weight of this coin: 24,5g and silver content 8%. Rare type.

picture 25.
This variety of YSK dollar 1914 has on reverse very clear grain of one leaf on the right side and also fatter leaf on the left side (which i very clear). Rare.

picture 26.
Gansu (Kansu) variety of YSK 1914. The most expensive one with all YSK 1914 varieties. It has 2 extra chinese characters on right and left side of obverse means made in Gansu or Gansu. Also downstairs it has like double teeth, except of those close to a rim. Very rare one.

picture 27.
And finally the lost one. This one is another Tibet variety of YSK 1914. A restrike which was made by Chinese communists in 1950's in Szechuan province for workers who were building a road in Tibet. This variety is 2nd variety. Except that teeth upstairs on the obverse are shorter, hair are not so clear, aslo mustache. Not clear is also part with stars. Sometimes it has small dot behind the ear but dot could be made by die. I have also seen the same type without dot. The first chinese character has thiner part. On the reverse leaves are more clear. Character "yuan" is in triangular shape.

That's all. Thanks for reading. I hope you enjoyed it. If you will find some new variety of YSK 1914 please share and post picture here and write what makes it so special then others.
I do hope my research will help many coin collectors here to discover the beauty of their common YSK 1914 dollar. Good luck. Now go to your Fatman dollars 1914 and check maybe you have rare type...
« Last Edit: November 09, 2011, 01:48:22 AM by KONDi »
KONDi
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Offline KONDi

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Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« Reply #1 on: November 09, 2011, 01:37:31 AM »
other photos... :001_rolleyes:
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Offline Birdman

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Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« Reply #2 on: November 09, 2011, 08:05:18 AM »
Thanks, Kondi.  I'll definitely be referring to this in the future.  Interesting stuff.

Offline dragondollar

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Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« Reply #3 on: November 14, 2011, 04:38:24 AM »
Nice article :) I wonder about the rarity of the 双O版 (double O) relative to the scarcest presented in this article? I have only one, and rarely saw it on the market.

Offline gxseries

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Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2011, 09:01:17 AM »
Very nice writeup Kondi. Thank you

Offline tkcoin

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Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« Reply #5 on: December 09, 2011, 12:35:29 AM »
too many varieties may kill variety.
the ones that sales are the "triangel yuan" and the "O" types of verieties.
Recently I heard some noice about "open eye" or "shut eye".

Offline KONDi

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Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« Reply #6 on: December 09, 2011, 05:18:22 AM »
Dear tkcoin,

Could you tell me something more about "open eye" and "shut eye" varieties??
That's very ineresting. Can you post some pictures of those 2 which you mentioned?
Thanks in advance!
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Offline KONDi

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Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« Reply #7 on: December 19, 2011, 02:51:31 AM »
Dear coin collectors and coin dealers,

I found another Hook variety of YSK 1914 dollar. This one is little better condition. Just for reference.
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Offline r3globe

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Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« Reply #8 on: December 19, 2011, 12:11:50 PM »
Hi Kondi, please look at this fatman dollar? Is this a variety? value? Thanks.


Offline dragondollar

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Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« Reply #9 on: December 19, 2011, 06:06:47 PM »
That's a Gansu dollar, this one. And a pretty nice one!

Offline KONDi

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Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2011, 12:54:32 AM »
Indeed, this is Gansu dollar. Very beautiful condition! And it is graded! by National Numismatic Certification if I am not wrong. This is not common Gansu dollar 1914, but bold variety, which is more rare than common Gansu. Please read description above to Picture nr 15 and also take a look on photo. I have one such of coin for sale. In raw it costs 180 USD. Yours is graded so it is worth 270 USD.
I found one also graded by National Numismatic Certification but common Gansu type 1914 with mark XF 40 for 560 USD some chinese coin collector who I know is selling. But is is common one, yours is bold variety so it could be more rare. I would give if I would be buying 270 USD for this piece. Beautiful coin!
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Offline r3globe

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Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« Reply #11 on: January 01, 2012, 02:41:57 PM »
Hi Kondi, Happy new year! Here is anothr fatman dollar I want you to look at? Also, please look at this Junk Dollar and tell me what you think? Thank youuuuuuuu!

Offline KONDi

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Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« Reply #12 on: January 02, 2012, 01:26:35 AM »
First one is common fatman 1914. I didn't find anything special on the surface of this coin. It is I believe in VG-F condition. I would pay for it 145 USD the most if I would be buying it.
About your Junk dollar 1934, it is also common. Condition is VF-XF, price 150 USD the most for this coin.
BTW, Happy New 2012 Year also for you!:)
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Offline Birdman

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Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« Reply #13 on: January 02, 2012, 06:55:41 AM »
First one is common fatman 1914. I didn't find anything special on the surface of this coin. It is I believe in VG-F condition. I would pay for it 145 USD the most if I would be buying it.
About your Junk dollar 1934, it is also common. Condition is VF-XF, price 150 USD the most for this coin.
BTW, Happy New 2012 Year also for you!:)

In checking recent sales on US eBay I see an NGC AU55 1914 dollar sold for $153.50 yesterday.  If you might be paying close to that amount for an ungraded VG-F does that mean that the market in China is paying more for these coins?

ebay 270879968360
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NGC-AU-55-China-1914-Republic-Silver-Dollar-1-/270879968360?pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item3f11b44c68#ht_990wt_899

Similarly, an NGC AU58 sold for $131.50 yesterday on US eBay, so paying $150 for a VF-XF has me wondering if these coins are getting scarcer in China or if demand is increasing?

ebay 220920024771
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NGC-AU-58-China-1934-Republic-Silver-Dollar-1-/220920024771?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item336fdc0ec3#ht_990wt_899

Birdman

Offline r3globe

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Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
« Reply #14 on: January 07, 2012, 04:42:57 PM »
Hi Kondi, Here is another 1914 Fatman I just bought. This one seems to have more details!! Do you see any variety there? Thank you :)