Author Topic: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar  (Read 9436 times)

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Offline KONDi

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Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« on: November 02, 2011, 12:28:19 AM »
Dear coin collectors and coin dealers,

I have been doing recently some research about varieties of YSK 1921 and I found 12 varieties of year 1921. Please check my photos and read about my research. Thanks to it maybe your collection will become more valuable if you have some rare variety.

1) 1921 YSK dollar. On the obverse the second character means "year" is in the shape of "7" ot "T" letter. It is common variety but the most common is the one without "T" or "7".

2) This YSK 1921 variety is very intersting. When you look on the obverse and reverse you won't find anything special.
But when you will take a look closely you will notice that on the reverse (marked on blue) there is long leave which is characteristic for YSK dollar 1919 with long leave. The design of obverse also looks different. Except character "ten" (marked on blue) the other characters which I marked on red are bold which is characteristic for YSK 1919 dollar.
My conclusion is that die of YSK 1919 with long leave (obverse) was redesigned. Except the stars part on the obverse, character "ten" and long leave on reverse which I all marked on blue everything which left is characteristic for YSK 1919. It is rare type.

3) This is next interesting variety. The part with stars on obverse (orange color) 3 stars with 4 has 6 arms and one has 5 arms. This is 6 arms' stars variety. Rare type.

4) On this variety of YSK 1921 the last character of the obverse is not connected. It is also rare one. I didn't see many.

5) Hook variety of YSK dollar 1921. This one looks like "T" or "7" variety, but it is not. When we take a look on the obverse we can see that second characters means "year" has a part is the shape of hook NOT "T" or "7". This one is also rare.

6) On the obverse of this YSK 1921. We can notice that second character "year", actually a small part is lifted up nearly connected with upper part. Rare for sure.

7) This is the most common type of YSK 1921.

8) Here is another YSK 1921 variety which is worth of interest. First of all the part where are star on YSK 1921 obverse doesn't look like on common YSK 1921. Hair are more clear on this YSK 1921. The eyebrow is more clear than on common YSK 1921.If I wouldn't see this year "ten" written as a chinese character I could say it is YSK 1920 Hainan variety. So, here's the question: why this YSK 1921 looks similar to YSK 1920 Hainan. My hypothesis is that the die of YSK 1920 was modified or changed a little bit. Character "9" was replaced by little bigger characher "ten". Except that everything is the same. So when they made this variety of YSK 1921 or they created new die and redesigned it. Or modified the die. Rare type.

9) On the obverse of this variety of YSK 1921 we can see that one star has 6 arms. First character means "made": upper part of this character is connected with tiny line with down part of this character. Character "ten", the arms of this character are bold as well as the hook of 5th chinese character. Rare type.

10) This is probably some private edition of YSK 1921. On the begining I thought the die of YSK 1914 was redesigned, when you look on the hair part. But all chinese character looks much thinner which doesn't match to this hypothesis.
Also eyelids are double. Rare private variety of YSK 1921.

11) Ladies (if there are some on this forum) and gentlemen. This is the rarest variety YSK 1921. It was made by warlord. It is called big ear variety of YSK 1921. Except bigger ear and different shape of eye, all chinese characters of obverse looks different. Especially 2 last one and character which means "year" it has a vertical line (no horizontal) which looks little for me like a torch.

12) and finally...the last variety of YSK 1921 which I discovered. On the obverse the second chinese character means "year": a small part of this character is in the shape of square. So I called it square variety of YSK 1921. Rare type.

Well that's all about YSK 1921 varieties. I hope you can learn something for this lesson. Probably most of collectors will have picture: 1, 4 and 7 varieties. Nr 7 is the most common, then nr 1 then 4 and then the rest. The rarest one is big ear variety.
KONDi
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Offline KONDi

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #1 on: November 02, 2011, 12:58:04 AM »
About picture nr 8. I discovered something new. There are 2 varieties of YSK 1920: both made in Hainan. Most of you will probably have that clear variety YSK 1920 (2 marked on red color). There is other variety of YSK 1920 made in Hainan, much more rarer with crude design (picture . The hair, eyebrow and stars part look still little clear but not os clear as on common variety of YSK 1920. But let's don't talk about it now. That will be the topic of my next post about 1920 varieties. My point is that YSK 1921 variety (with marked on red 1) is more similar to YSK 1920 crude variety (with marked on red 3). So my final hypothesis is that YSK 1921 on this picture 8 it is redesigned die of YSK 1920 crude variety from Hainan to creat this YSK 1921. I would like to mark it clearly, crude one (marked with red colored 3) not the one which is more clear (marked with red colored 2). I hope my everything what I wrote here is clear.
That's all about YSK 1921 varieties:)
KONDi
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Offline KONDi

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #2 on: December 07, 2011, 06:03:38 AM »
Dear chinese coin collectors and coin dealers,

Recently I discovered new 13th variety of YSK dollar 1921.

13. This one is very interesting. On the obverse there is nothing special you can find but the reverse is the part of the coin on which you can find many interesting elements which are exactly the same as at http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=4330.0 YSK dollar 1919 5 lollipops variety on picture 1i. Please take a look on this this fatman 1919 on picture 1i and compare the reverse of this coin with reverse of this YSK 1921 on picture 13 here. If I am not wrong they match perfectly and they are exactly the same. 5 teeth below the ribbon on reverse have small balls which looks like lollipops. On the right side also one long leaf is more clear than others. I am not sure exactly about a dot inside of one grains of leaf, because the picture which I found is not so good quality but if my hypothesis is right the die from reverse of YSK 1919 (on picture 1i) has been used to produce this YSK 1921 5 lollipops variety. It is rare variety of YSK 1921.
KONDi
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Offline marbury518

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #3 on: March 24, 2012, 03:53:56 PM »
Just got one today.....been reading the descriptions but nothing jumped out at me yet....may need to
wait until its in hand.

Offline KONDi

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2012, 07:33:32 AM »
Dear marbury518,

This is just Tianjin Central Mint common variety. I didn't find anything special on the obverse and reverse of this coin. It has 4 lines on the reverse below close to character "yuan" which are little more visuable, but this is from die and does not rise the value of the coin. I have similar on my 1921 YSK with "7". You can take a look.
KONDi
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Offline marbury518

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2012, 04:40:56 PM »
Thanks for letting me know....at least it was inexpensive, about 50 euros.

Offline marbury518

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #6 on: September 22, 2012, 06:08:58 AM »
Hello ......perhaps Kondi or another authority might cast an eye over this example for me.....described as uncirculated by big well known auction house.

Any info, observation, original mint, etc very welcome.

Offline KONDi

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #7 on: September 26, 2012, 08:59:21 PM »
Dear marbury518,

This piece which you showed here is in AU/UNC condition, but the photo is too small to judge exactly is it AU or UNC condition. I would need a better photo of this coin. Well, it is just common fatman dollar 1921, Tianjin central mint---nothing special in this coin. I used to sell similar coin but in much worse condition. Please take a look on photos below.
KONDi
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Offline marbury518

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #8 on: September 26, 2012, 10:06:15 PM »
Thanks.......I didn't buy it as the auction is over and I didn't have enough info.....out of the 1921's for sale....this fetched the most.
$270 plus buyer premium...so around $350 with shipping I imagine. Many thanks....marbury

Offline poconopenn

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #9 on: September 29, 2012, 05:55:01 PM »
marbury518

Please post picture of reedings. Just want to confirm if this coin is genuine.

KNODi

Your coin may be questionable. The surface of you coin is not right for any genuine coin.

Offline marbury518

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #10 on: September 30, 2012, 12:35:18 AM »
As I said, I didn't buy it so wouldn't be able to offer any further photos. Sorry.

Offline KONDi

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #11 on: October 22, 2012, 06:12:21 AM »
Dear poconopenn,

My fatman dollar 1921 is a genuine coin. It might looks for you questionable but this coin is in my collection since I started my adventure with old chinese silver coins. You circled using black collor that there is something wrong with second chinese character. Could you explain what do you mean because I don't see any problem here. You also circled space between 2 chinese characters on reverse. if you mean those hidden leaves which appearing, that I must say that this is why I decided buy this piece because it has somethng unusual. The extra hidden leaves might be result of some die error. Let's take a look on next thing which you marked in a black circle is one leaf...but what exactly do you mean. Finally you circled in back 2 leaves. Do you mean damages on those 2 leaves? If yes, then I must tell you that on this coin I found similar damages on right side also on reverse on some other leaves which I marked on some blue color. This coin might look for you questionable but I assure you that this is genuine coin. When I bought it, it was a little bit dirty so I decided to clean it in lemon acid, which later I realized I shouldn't do, because the coin will lose their beauty. I still saved the scan of this coin how it looked like when I bought it. For reference I also took a photo of edge, obverse and reverse of my coin. Many my friendly coin collectors and coin dealers have seen coin and all of them said it is genuine piece.
KONDi
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Offline dragondollar

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #12 on: October 22, 2012, 03:55:32 PM »
Poconopenn circled these areas because they all seem to have some kind of bumps, which would indeed be very suspicious. I would be less categoric than him though, because on these pictures I find it is hard to see clearly if these are real bumps (relief) or some kind of scratches/nick, which could happen on a genuine coin. It is better to simply avoid buying this kind of damaged coins anyway.

Offline KONDi

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #13 on: November 10, 2012, 08:21:12 AM »
Dear dragondollar,

Indeed we should avoid buying damaged coins. However don't you think that sometimes damaged coins carry some kind of interesting piece od history with themselves?
Those circled areas which poconopenn marked and those which also you mentioned have some kind of bumps and also scratches. The areas marked in black circles contain scratches. I can't show better picture of my coin to show this.

Those other areas also circled on black, especially the one between characher "yi" and "yuan" have bumps.
I took a look on the rest of my YSK dollars 1921 coins which I sell. I found that all of those with "T" variety on a second character from from left on obverse---all those "T" variety, on reverse has bumps in the same place.

I even found one junk dollar 1934 (which is not my coin). It has bump on one sail.

My theory is that those bumps were made during producing process and might be restult of some die error. That's only theory and of course I could be wrong. My point is that these coins for sure are genuine---not questionable.
KONDi
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Offline KONDi

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #14 on: February 17, 2013, 10:49:45 PM »
Dear all,

This is another discover among YSK silver dollars family. On a picture nr 14 you can see another variety of YSK dollar 1921. What is outstanding in this piece? Nothing really special, except the fact that 2 chinese characters which mean in English "made" and "year" have something special. Let's focus on first chinese character. The shape is different then general issued one. The line which is below the part of this character which looks numer 4 is straight, not wavy shape, which we can notice on general issued YSK 1921. Now below this straight line, the next part of this character---which is in rectangle shape is thiner and wider than on thos YSK 1921 pieces general issued. The next character 年 "year" the part of this character---the line which should be horizontal is vertical and it is connected with upper and lower part of this whole chinese character. This is the key point of this variety. The coin weight: 26,6g and has 39mm in diameter. I suspect this is general issued one but because of mold reason this part of chinese character "nian" is vertical not horizontal one. This variety called "vertical "nian" character YSK 1921.
KONDi
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Offline poconopenn

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #15 on: February 17, 2013, 11:23:06 PM »
Dear all,

This is another discover among YSK silver dollars family. On a picture nr 14 you can see another variety of YSK dollar 1921. What is outstanding in this piece? Nothing really special, except the fact that 2 chinese characters which mean in English "made" and "year" have something special. Let's focus on first chinese character. The shape is different then general issued one. The line which is below the part of this character which looks numer 4 is straight, not wavy shape, which we can notice on general issued YSK 1921. Now below this straight line, the next part of this character---which is in rectangle shape is thiner and wider than on thos YSK 1921 pieces general issued. The next character 年 "year" the part of this character---the line which should be horizontal is vertical and it is connected with upper and lower part of this whole chinese character. This is the key point of this variety. The coin weight: 26,6g and has 39mm in diameter. I suspect this is general issued one but because of mold reason this part of chinese character "nian" is vertical not horizontal one. This variety called "vertical "nian" character YSK 1921.

Sorry, IMO, this is a fake coin. The vertical line in year was added later. The eneven wear and uncharacteristic relief in many places suggesting this is not a genuine coin.

Offline KONDi

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Re: Beautiful varieties of 1921 YSK dollar
« Reply #16 on: February 17, 2013, 11:33:08 PM »
Dear poconopenn,

I respect your opinion and thank you for sharing it with me and everyone. I wouldn't say this coin is fake. But I would agree with you that vertical line in year was added later. That's possible.
KONDi
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