Author Topic: NCS or not?  (Read 4896 times)

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Offline Obsidian

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NCS or not?
« on: September 19, 2011, 01:14:29 AM »
I recently picked up the 1993-2004 Lunar Scallop series in OMP.  All coins are sealed and have original boxes / COAs.  I was hoping to keep them this way for the time being.  All coins are in great shape with no white spots or toning.  The only coin that is giving me heartburn is the 2001 Snake.  It has a spot on it by the snakes tail.  At first I thought it was a white spot but on closer examination it looks like it is some foreign object on the INSIDE of the capsule.  It isn't even on the coin.  The problem is I can tell whatever the object is, has put a small amount of moisture or something that is causing some haze on either the capsule or possibly the coin.  It almost looks like condensation on a window.  I'm thinking the object might have been a food crumb or something. SEE PHOTOS.

My question is:  Should I cut the coin out and remove the object.  If there is some mark on the coin I can NCS/NGC it.  I really don't want to cut it open as it matches the other 11. And I don't want to have just one of the 12 coins sent into NCS / NGC as I was planning on keeping them OMP for now.
Any suggestions?

Thanks
« Last Edit: September 19, 2011, 01:24:09 AM by Obsidian »

Offline buynicething

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Re: NCS or not?
« Reply #1 on: September 19, 2011, 01:59:39 AM »
That is tough.  My opinion is that since the object is damaging the coin it must be removed.  Ncs can do this much more safely than you.  Best to let them have a try.  If they can you may get a 69.  You could sell it and buy another omp, and something else. 

In short right now it is a problem coin. 
NCS gives you the best chance to change that. 

Offline mrslick32

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Re: NCS or not?
« Reply #2 on: September 19, 2011, 12:05:24 PM »
This is tough. My suggestion given that you want to keep everything in omp os to buy another snake scallop in omp. Send the snake you have to ncs and ngc. You can try selling it to pay for the snake coin that you will buy. That is what I will do if I were you.

Offline Obsidian

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Re: NCS or not?
« Reply #3 on: September 19, 2011, 12:16:13 PM »
Yea that is what I am hoping to do for now.

Offline ghostrider80811

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Re: NCS or not?
« Reply #4 on: October 08, 2011, 06:14:59 PM »
It looks like the snake is not OMP.  Can I ask who you bought the coin from? 

Offline Obsidian

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Re: NCS or not?
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2011, 12:55:13 AM »
I believe this is actually what the mint seal looked like for the flowered lunar coins.  I did not purchase these from Xu Hong but here is a photo of a similar seal from Xu Hong.  He says it is original mint sealed.  I have also seen a couple of others with this same seal from other sellers.  Xu Hong also has a full sheet and the part of the seal that looks different goes down the middle of the full sheet.

Offline nupcoll

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Re: NCS or not?
« Reply #6 on: October 10, 2011, 04:50:51 PM »
Hi Obsidian,

Just wondering have you sent the coin to NCS? I have a coin having exactly same kind of spot and would like to know whether NCS helped.

thanks

Offline badon

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Re: NCS or not?
« Reply #7 on: October 12, 2011, 08:28:46 PM »
My best guess for this type of spot is that it's the residue that's left over after a spot of water/acid dries up on a coin. All the junk floating in the water ends up in a single spot in the center. The coin is not original double-sealed, so it's probably one that was rejected for grading. Maybe NCS can improve the appearance enough to earn a 69 grade. The spot is not in a conspicuous location, so it might end up looking OK once they're done with it.

Offline Obsidian

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Re: NCS or not?
« Reply #8 on: October 13, 2011, 02:44:16 AM »
If it isn't original double sealed then the pictures I linked from Xu Hong are not OMP?  The packaging of my coin is identical to Xu Hongs coins and I didn't buy them from him.  If this is not OMP then my coin is a Xu Hong reseal I bought from someone else?  I don't really care I'm just trying to figure out what OMP should look like for the flowered silver lunars.  Also if it is a Xu Hong seal then it is unlikely that it has been submitted and cracked.  I doubt Xu Zong does much of that.  I have a full set of this series with this "packaging".  Also, Xu Hong specifically refers to his coins in this packaging as original mint sealed.  I see no reason he would lie considering the recent fallout.

Offline badon

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Re: NCS or not?
« Reply #9 on: October 13, 2011, 03:31:42 AM »
Sorry for the confusion, I was referring to your snake, not Xu Hong's dragon. Xu Hong's reseals use mint equipment, so they're indistinguishable from the originals. The reseal on the snake is a sloppier version that is obviously different from a quality reseal job.

Offline Obsidian

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Re: NCS or not?
« Reply #10 on: October 13, 2011, 12:00:27 PM »
You probably can't see it too well from the pictures.  It really is identical to the Xu Hong pictures I showed.  I have a full set of these all with the identical seal.  They all look like the Xu Hong pictures I linked.  You think those pictures from Xu Hong are reseals?  Basically ALL of the 93+ flowered silver lunars he has have this same seal....

Offline badon

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Re: NCS or not?
« Reply #11 on: October 14, 2011, 03:47:56 AM »
I think I am mistaken. I have not seen very many fake seals on the scallop lunars, since most of them grade well, so there's usually no shabby coins to reseal. I don't see white spots on them very often though.

Underbidder

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Re: NCS or not?
« Reply #12 on: October 14, 2011, 03:50:44 AM »
I think I am mistaken. I have not seen very many fake seals on the scallop lunars, since most of them grade well, so there's usually no shabby coins to reseal. I don't see white spots on them very often though.

"Shabby coins?  To reseal " ?  Why would ANYONE DO that?   :(

Offline Obsidian

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Re: NCS or not?
« Reply #13 on: October 14, 2011, 05:36:40 AM »
I think I am mistaken. I have not seen very many fake seals on the scallop lunars, since most of them grade well, so there's usually no shabby coins to reseal. I don't see white spots on them very often though.

Yea Badon, this time you are incorrect.  Probably doesn't happen often  :001_tt2:.  I am quite sure the coins I have and the coins Xu Hong is selling are original mint sealed coins (Shenyang mint I believe).  It seems that the 10 coin sheets have the typical shenyang mint seal on 3 sides but down the middle of the sheet the seal is different.  So when they are cut apart and sold individually you end up with 3 sides that are sealed the same and a 4th that has a different pattern (narrow lines and what looks to be extra plastic folded over).  If you look at the Shenyang 1/2 oz silver pandas they look the exact same way.

Since I have the whole 93-04 set in OMP with box / COA I am having a hard time bringing myself to get them graded.  Because they are double sealed with capsule I worry less about damage from the plastic.  I still am not sure the Chinese collectors are sold on the whole grading thing...I on the other hand like seeing those numbers, good or bad.

Offline Obsidian

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Re: NCS or not?
« Reply #14 on: October 14, 2011, 05:51:41 AM »
On a side note, I ended up getting a second snake in OMP so I could still have the set and so I could submit this coin to NCS/NGC.  So I went ahead and opened up the coin.  There was a small foreign particle on the plastic where the spot is, but the spot is on the coin.  It doesn't look like a WSOD exactly so there is a chance NCS can clean it up.  Guess i'll see once I submit it.  I almost think it was a food crumb and as it dried out inside the capsule it put off a little moisure onto the coin.  Not sure if that is possible but who knows. It is an excellent looking coin but it does appear to have a couple of small hairlines in the field in the loop of the snake body at 12 oclock above the spot.  Had to have happened during minting / packaging due to where they hairlines are.  Odd.
« Last Edit: October 14, 2011, 06:01:33 AM by Obsidian »