Author Topic: 1990 16.5 oz Vault Protector silver  (Read 1123 times)

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Offline pandamonium

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1990 16.5 oz Vault Protector silver
« on: April 28, 2020, 09:30:48 AM »
Diamond in the rough?
Vault Protector are popular and in demand, especially the big gold.
One of many medals i have tracked.    Have seen about 2 or 3 in the last 7 to 8 yrs on ebay.    No topic on this forum that i could find.
Mr Ge's purple book has the 1990 15 oz Vault Protector Gold w/ 99 mintage but not this heavyweight silver.
General opinion is 999 mintage same as 1987 5 oz Vault silver.   NGC has 143 pop for the 87 and 22 pop for this 90.
Could mintage be 199?
This one is numbered 142.    Do you know of any other numbers?    Higher numbers?  Were they melted?
Do you have any information on this big bruiser?
This could be a overlooked beauty w/ potential.   
Waiting for reply from dealer in China and expert whom will contact Chinese....
Please post any information or ask experts questions....

Offline pandamonium

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Re: 1990 16.5 oz Vault Protector silver
« Reply #1 on: May 04, 2020, 09:26:26 PM »
Here is some more info on the early year gold & silver Vault Protectors up to 1990.      (I did not include the 1998, newer issue or other early issue i am not aware of.)

Year Gold                 Size                        Plan mint                                NGC graded pop total
1982 Xian                 10 oz                      100                                        9
1985 Bao Yuan          1/10 oz                   1,500                                     155
1990 Bao Yuan          1 oz                        1,500                                     36
1990 Blessings          1/10 oz                   5,000                                     34
1990 Tang Dynasty    15 oz                      99                                         10

Year Silver                Size                        Plan mint                                NGC graded pop total
1987                         5 oz                       999                                         143
1990 Bao Yuan          1 oz                        5,000                                      268
1990 Tang                16.5 oz                      ?                                           22

The rarest three are....
1) 1982 big 10 oz Xian gold w/ 9 NGC pop                            Big price
2) 1990 bigger 15 oz Tang gold w/ 10 NGC pop                     Big price
3) 1990 biggest 16.5 oz silver w/ 22 NGC pop                       Affordable price?

Offline pandamonium

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Re: 1990 16.5 oz Vault Protector silver
« Reply #2 on: May 08, 2020, 05:08:44 PM »
A collector sent me these photos of the 1990  16.5 silver Vault...

COA says 15 oz but NGC says 16.5 oz.

COA says 999 mintage but where are they?    Does anyone know of supply?...

The 90 16.5 silver has same design as 90 15 oz gold Vault.      The 2 big golds are the best and expensive.   I would rank the big silver as third....

Offline pandamonium

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Re: 1990 16.5 oz Vault Protector silver
« Reply #3 on: May 10, 2020, 08:53:41 AM »
I was told the 2 big gold Vaults were last priced in the $30,000 range.   Anyone have recent sales prices?

The PF 65 big silver was listed on ebay for about $1,000 and no bids.    Seller said it sold later.

The big silver Vaults seem very undervalued to me as the Chinese love the Vault Protectors.....

Offline bonke

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Re: 1990 16.5 oz Vault Protector silver
« Reply #4 on: May 10, 2020, 02:16:33 PM »
A few years ago, a 1990 15oz gold vault protector was offered in Kowloon.  A beautiful medal in an NGC holder.  The hammer price (including commission) was approximately $72,000.  The final bidding was between one of our forum members (who was at the auction and sitting next to me) and an unknown female who was bidding by telephone.  Unfortunately, our forum member dropped out and the mystery bidder prevailed.  I was so envious of the successful purchaser.  A medal this large is easy to behold.  Magnification is not required.

Mark Bonke

Offline pandamonium

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Re: 1990 16.5 oz Vault Protector silver
« Reply #5 on: May 10, 2020, 05:43:48 PM »
Thanks for the post bonke.    I was told about $30,000 but that seemed very low.    Was hoping someone would post more info.   $72,000 seems about right.     Could you imagine owning the big 3 Vaults?
Gold is obviously more expensive than silver, but about $1,000 for the 16.5 oz silver Vault?     Stupid cheap.     The Chinese love the Vaults and the big ones w/ low mintage should command big prices.     The big gold should bring the price of the silver up too, in time.    Maybe my post will help someone to target and buy the silver if they can find one.    Any of the big 3 for sale in China?    Maybe upcoming auction?
Now if we can get a handle on actual mintage and surviving pop....

Offline pandamonium

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Re: 1990 16.5 oz Vault Protector silver
« Reply #6 on: May 21, 2020, 01:29:03 PM »
I was contacted about a auction in China last night (or recently?)...
1990 PF 68  16.5 Vault silver      $1,350  SOLD        NGC now has 24 total pop w/ 1 PF 69

Regardless of sale price and opinions, i still say it is very undervalued.     Could the gold version Vault be worth close to $100,000 today, not the $72,000 selling price a few years ago?     Can it pull up the silver price?     This market is still semi immature so it has a long ways to go.     In the future, IF NGC has graded pop of 400 to 500 then i will change my mind.   Interesting and fun market to be a part of...


jsmineset   USA Watchdog  "President Trump splitting Deep State...."
Dave Hodges Common Sense Show  "The Covid 19 destruction....."



Offline pandamonium

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Re: 1990 16.5 oz Vault Protector silver
« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2020, 09:09:04 AM »
Could Clark have sold the last of his five 87 5 oz  silver Vaults?   $750

NGC pop for the 87 5 oz is now 146 total.   
NGC pop for the 90 16.5 oz is now 24 total.     Only 2 more have been graded since my post 2 months ago.
COA says both have 1,000 mint but T Square was 1989 so 1990 Plan mints are off...
As the price of the 1990 15 oz Gold Vault goes up then it has to affect the 16.5 silver.    My biased prediction, if the actual mintage is very low, then it should be priced at about 1/2 the value of the gold Vault.   Why not as the market matures?    I was told Vault Protectors are highly prized in China....

South China Morning Post  "Kingold Jewelry secures US $2.8 billion in loans w/ gilded copper bars....."
The Chinese counterfeiters have shafted the world w/ fake gold/silver for many years.    The Chinese counterfeiters have shafted their fellow Chinese in China too.     Sounds fair to me....
Will this encourage the Chinese government to crack down on fakes?    It should add value to graded and genuine Chinese gold/silver coins/medals...

Anonymous  "The Chinese debt trap is overtaking the entire world"....
   

Offline pandamonium

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Re: 1990 16.5 oz Vault Protector silver
« Reply #8 on: July 10, 2020, 09:51:44 PM »
A bit more info on this big silver, see photo.

China;  2 sales each in 2017 & 18.     1 sale each in 2019 & 20.   

Yuan to USD  7,770 Y = $1,109 USD,  7,455 Y = $1,065 USD,  5,775 Y = $825 USD,  9,765 Y = $1,395 USD

Rare & undervalued.    I am convinced now...

Goldseek   "Banking on a bluff;  The biggest gold scam in modern history".     (gilt copper in China)
Gold Review   "60 m oz of digital silver just traded in 15 minutes"             (60 million oz)
The gold/silver price con game will continue until the bitter end.....

Offline pandamonium

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Re: 1990 16.5 oz Vault Protector silver
« Reply #9 on: July 31, 2020, 10:36:34 PM »
Trying to make a point here, some info from Pricepedia and ebay.   Not everyone agrees w/ my comments.   Could not get values for several i wanted like the 1990 Vault Protector 1 oz gold & 1 oz silver.      Ratio of silver vs gold...

1989 PF 67 5 oz gold God of Wealth       ebay  $19,000
1989 PF 67 3.3 oz silver God of Wealth            $700              3 to 1 ratio

1989 PF 69 HK Expo 1 oz silver    $300
1989 PF 69 HK Expo 1/2 oz gold   $900                                 3 to 1 ratio

1989 PF 69 NY Expo 1 oz silver    $113
1989 PF 69 NY Expo 1/4 gold       $440                                  4 to 1 ratio

1989 PF 69 ANA Cincinnati  1 oz gold        $2,200
1989 PF 69 ANA Cincinnati  1 oz silver       $275                      8 to 1 ratio

1988 PF 69 1,000Y 12 oz gold panda    $25,000
1988 PF 69 100Y   12 oz silver panda    $1,000                        25 to 1 ratio

1990 15 oz Gold Vault Protector    $100,000                                                 assume the $72k price years ago is now $100K
1990 16.5 Silver Vault Protector    $1,000                              100 to 1 ratio!     

 This for me means the big silver Vault is undervalued.    It is the only gold vs silver, I know of, that has that large of a ratio.    Maybe not the most accurate info but you get the point.....