Author Topic: buying ungraded panda coins  (Read 749 times)

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Offline dkryder

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buying ungraded panda coins
« on: May 16, 2018, 12:24:41 PM »
hello,
 i purchased several panda coins in 2008,2009, 2010. most of them ungraded. i did however do some research on bogus pandas to try to learn as much as i could about determining if the coins i purchased were valid pandas. but, to be honest, i'm not certain. now, i'd like to sell a few so i'm looking at grading services and it seems pcgs would be a good choice. i'd like to hear others opinions on pcgs and other services. i'd also be interested in hearing if others also bought ungraded pandas in the past decade and the experiences you had. ok, thanks. i've lurked here for a while but need to learn some others info so i hope to post a bit going forward. thanks.

Offline Agpanda

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Re: buying ungraded panda coins
« Reply #1 on: May 16, 2018, 01:55:38 PM »
Hi and welcome to the forum
I prefer NGC as I have most of my PCGS got milkspots
That is on MS70 coins, I have some from NGC also with milkspots
Most of my coins are NGC and I will only buy NGC in the future
But as always, I is some that prefer PCGS instead
Good luck with the grading

Offline wyldkatt

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Re: buying ungraded panda coins
« Reply #2 on: May 16, 2018, 04:49:37 PM »
Welcome to the forum.....
PCGS usually brings better price on resale,
simply because they've always been King of the mountain.....
Yet NGC is affiliated with NCS, the conservation service,
so there's that +......
Remember, it's the coin, NOT the slab!!

Offline Jens

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Re: buying ungraded panda coins
« Reply #3 on: May 16, 2018, 05:00:43 PM »
I would recommend NGC for modern chinese coins. No offense wyldkatt but i don't believe what you wrote about resale prices is true for pandas or mcc in general.

Offline wyldkatt

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Re: buying ungraded panda coins
« Reply #4 on: May 16, 2018, 05:24:04 PM »
No worries Jens.
No offense taken.
What you say may very well be the case.
I'm an old school collector, and from that viewpoint,
it was always PCGS that we sought out.
Mainly because NGC had their problems on Chinese coins
back "in the day".
They had even graded 'counterfeit' coins, and slabbed them.
But hey, I'm no expert, for sure!

Offline KeepOnTrying!

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Re: buying ungraded panda coins
« Reply #5 on: May 16, 2018, 11:06:46 PM »
This issue has been discussed quite a lot in this forum. A little research of the archives will generate relevant information. There is anecdotal evidence that suggests NGC as being pre-eminent in MCC collectors’ choice for TPG. But a significant number of MCC is still being graded by PCGS. Furthermore, PCGS seems to be pre-eminent in grading rare coins and a host of other country numismatic coins.
KeepOnTrying and Never Give Up!
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Online Mirkkanen

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Re: buying ungraded panda coins
« Reply #6 on: May 17, 2018, 01:30:21 AM »
No offense, but it is best not to post confusing or conflicting information, especially when attempting to give advice.

Anyone who submits modern Chinese coinage to PCGS has got to be crazy. The entire community is basically an agreement that it's NGC, or leave it ungraded.

Offline pandamonium

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Re: buying ungraded panda coins
« Reply #7 on: May 17, 2018, 07:48:43 AM »
This seller in Germany sells mostly PCGS and gets decent prices & usually has good stock...

1993 S50Y  PR 69  Yin Yang or Fu Lu Shou  silver 5 oz    $7,999                 Ebay 263674235115... rare on ebay...

He also sold a 95 S3Y  PR 69  Fu Lu Shou for $89 about 1 1/2 months ago so at times has good prices...   Warmshy now has 2 on ebay OMP for $250 ea....

I also see more Goldfish sales 1984 & 90 selling on ebay in silver, brass, etc...


Automatic Earth  "I am Julian Assange"....worth the read...


Offline KeepOnTrying!

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Re: buying ungraded panda coins
« Reply #8 on: May 17, 2018, 08:20:30 AM »
It is incumbent on anyone providing “advice” to be as balanced as possible irrespective of personal practice patterns.

Even if I have not bought a PCGS slabbed coin for a long time, with most likely 99% or more of my coins being graded by NGC, my answer to the query raised by the newly registered member remains the same:

1: Look through our archives to get the different perspectives expressed by members in previous discussions.
2: NGC seems to be currently popular amongst modern Chinese coin collectors, for example in this forum.
3: PCGS still grades and encapsulates a lot of modern Chinese coins. One shouldn’t gain the impression that NGC is the only game in town. A quick review of sites like eBay and discussion forums supports this assertion. A lot of collectors in Europe and increasingly in China grade coins through PCGS.
4: It seems that PCGS has expertise in grading rare coins, or used to be regarded as having such skills. I haven’t heard otherwise recently.

*Opinion has been expressed in the past that PCGS slabs may have been problematic, at least at a certain time. I have not seen any scientific report to support this assertion. However, due to the fact that some prominent forum members expressed that opinion one has to take the possibility into consideration. But it is still anecdotal information.

Anecdotal information can be useful in the absence of data obtained through rigorous research but it should always be acknowledged as such because of its short comings!
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Offline dkryder

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Re: buying ungraded panda coins
« Reply #9 on: May 17, 2018, 09:14:53 AM »
thanks for the replies. i have a bit more reading to do about the grading companies.  i notice they both have tiers that have max coin values. if i send a coin that they determine is over the value limit for that tier what happens? for instance ngc has a max value of $3,000 for several tiers with the express tier at $10,000 max value. so if i submit a world coin at standard tier and they determine the value is over 3 grand do i then get charged the express tier $60 fee if it is say valued at $4,000? or what about a 2009 UHR gold coin submitted under gold tier that they determine has value over $3,000, same thing? is there a list somewhere of what value is assigned to a specific grading? thanks.

Offline 1668Chris

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Re: buying ungraded panda coins
« Reply #10 on: May 17, 2018, 10:10:02 AM »
Don’t overthink the TPG’s.  NGC’s holder is far superior than PCGS.  Regarding value, it’s not only used for grading tier but also the amount of postal insurance on the trip back to you.  If you lowball the value to save a few bucks on grading and the package gets lost you are out a lot more than $20 or $30 you saved.   If you think the coin is worth $3k then put $3k on the submission form.

Offline KeyDate1/2ozPandas

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Re: buying ungraded panda coins
« Reply #11 on: May 17, 2018, 12:59:59 PM »
You can choose the value as you wish, they don't scrutinize it that carefully.  Chris is right about the insurance, but I have never lost a single package from NGC.  If you have coin between $1000-$5000 value, putting $3000 is fine.  If you have $7000 coin or it melts for above $3000 then you need to go to the next tier.

I once submitted a coin that looked horrible, I thought it would be PF65-66 so I put under $1000 NCS+NGC tier despite its value being over $8K even in that condition and paid $26 for NCS and NGC fees.  It came back PF69 after conservation and I sold it for $42K a week later.  Nobody is really scrutinizing the values, but if it gets damaged or lost, that number could haunt you.

Offline dkryder

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Re: buying ungraded panda coins
« Reply #12 on: May 19, 2018, 05:09:25 AM »
thanks for the feedback. i'm wondering if ngc notifies the member of the grade prior to shipping the coin back and allows for bumping up a tier by the member to cover for insurance in the case of the coin grading higher than expected.

Offline KeepOnTrying!

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Re: buying ungraded panda coins
« Reply #13 on: May 19, 2018, 05:47:41 AM »
thanks for the feedback. i'm wondering if ngc notifies the member of the grade prior to shipping the coin back and allows for bumping up a tier by the member to cover for insurance in the case of the coin grading higher than expected.

NGC sends you the grade by email just as they despatch the completed job to you. I suspect it will be too late then to change the value. But you could talk to them on the phone ahead of time although this could add more complexities to the process!
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