Author Topic: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal  (Read 19807 times)

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Offline poconopenn

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #30 on: September 11, 2015, 05:33:19 PM »
the first page of the sell thread of jibi in your link state the price and someone still buying now. However, it does not stated the agreed buying price.

 

I bought one set last night at the same price posted.

Offline poconopenn

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #31 on: September 11, 2015, 05:42:49 PM »
First, this is ugly and bald panda design by Nanjing mints which I totally agree. However, this is selling so well even there are few type of material used for this ugly and bald design panda. Why those collectors buy it and pay for high premium???? All of them loss of mind and no brainer?


I have to give credit to sellers for their skillful and aggressive promotion with nice videos and pictures, simultaneously at three different forums. Even negative comments and the warming of “mintage trap” of recently minted medals from several members of this forum can not stop their efforts to gain the visibility of this medal.

Just for information and a friendly advice.

China Mint has produced about 3,100 MCC since 1979 and more than 1,000 medals since 2013, several times more than all medals produced in the prior years. Most medals produced are low mintage (less than 2,000) and commissioned by the third party. The “mintage trap” and quality of the medals ought to be considered before making investment decision in those medals, especially when those medals have an exceptional high numismatic premium. Unless you are an experienced, knowledgeable coin/medal collector, with as much or more knowledge than your numismatic dealer possesses, investing in "numismatics premium" is a high-risk proposition.



Offline poconopenn

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #32 on: September 11, 2015, 05:55:43 PM »
Frank Wong and other collectors have done a lot research on white spot development on coins and medal. Storage is one of the small factor for the white spot development which is not the main factor.

You claim Nanjing mints has poor minting technology as compare to other. White spot of coins/medal can cause by minting technology and processes. Please post as many photo here to prove that Nanjing mints produce poorly design and white spot prompted products than three other official mints and internationally mints. Maple by Canada mints, proof britannia 2013 and 2014, all tend to white spot which due to the minting processes as my view.

Panda expo 1, macao panda expo 1, long corridor of classical garden and recent years of silver bullion panda coin which produce by Shanghai mints which you claim more superior than Nanjing mints for minting technology are all famous of white spot. Why you are not mentioned it on and on and on?


Please read the white spots article published by China Mint in the following thread and my summary of the article (Reply # 11). All silver coins will form white spots. The timing is depending on the storage condition as well as the roughness of the mirror surface. IMO, Nanjing Mint still use the old method, leather belt, to polish the blank, instead of chemical treatment currently used by all major mints, consequently, a less rough mirror surface and slower in developing white spots.

http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=7823.0

barsenault

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #33 on: September 11, 2015, 06:09:44 PM »
I have to give credit to sellers for their skillful and aggressive promotion with nice videos and pictures, simultaneously at three different forums. Even negative comments and the warming of “mintage trap” of recently minted medals from several members of this forum can not stop their efforts to gain the visibility of this medal.

Just for information and a friendly advice.

China Mint has produced about 3,100 MCC since 1979 and more than 1,000 medals since 2013, several times more than all medals produced in the prior years. Most medals produced are low mintage (less than 2,000) and commissioned by the third party. The “mintage trap” and quality of the medals ought to be considered before making investment decision in those medals, especially when those medals have an exceptional high numismatic premium. Unless you are an experienced, knowledgeable coin/medal collector, with as much or more knowledge than your numismatic dealer possesses, investing in "numismatics premium" is a high-risk proposition.



I think you are giving the sellers too much credit and not enough credit to the brain power, decision making capability, and thinking prowess of those who actually bought.  Ouch.  :scared:

Offline Birdman

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #34 on: September 11, 2015, 08:57:53 PM »
I have to give credit to sellers for their skillful and aggressive promotion with nice videos and pictures, simultaneously at three different forums. Even negative comments and the warming of “mintage trap” of recently minted medals from several members of this forum can not stop their efforts to gain the visibility of this medal.

Just for information and a friendly advice.

China Mint has produced about 3,100 MCC since 1979 and more than 1,000 medals since 2013, several times more than all medals produced in the prior years. Most medals produced are low mintage (less than 2,000) and commissioned by the third party. The “mintage trap” and quality of the medals ought to be considered before making investment decision in those medals, especially when those medals have an exceptional high numismatic premium. Unless you are an experienced, knowledgeable coin/medal collector, with as much or more knowledge than your numismatic dealer possesses, investing in "numismatics premium" is a high-risk proposition.





China Mint has produced about 3,100 MCC since 1979 and more than 1,000 medals since 2013, several times more than all medals produced in the prior years. Most medals produced are low mintage (less than 2,000) and commissioned by the third party.

Wow, I didn't realize the mints have been so busy, recently.  And if these medals have sold as well as reported, despite the high numismatic premium, it will surely inspire the minting of new medals, soon to be marketed.  Will the new money go to the next wave of private issues, or to drive up the numismatic premium of the current issues even more?  I'm not smart enough to play that trade, but I'm a more conservative, traditional investor, so I'll leave the the adrenaline chess match to others.



andrewlee10

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #35 on: September 11, 2015, 09:17:20 PM »
IMO, there are a lot of PRO-medal threads on CCF right now and, while it is a breath of fresh air to have them, it is also very important to have both views on medals on public record. The medal lovers (who are mostly new to MCC collecting?) seem to get so bothered when non-medal lovers provide an alternate opinion.

As far as I can tell, poconopenn is simply using his experience (and personal bias) to warn prospective investors/collectors/buyers about the potential perils of "investing" in medals, especially those (inferiorly) produced by what he believes to be mints with poor quality control and minimal experience. You do not need to be offended by his statements. On the contrary, you should investigate them. If he is wrong, you have lost nothing and this will strengthen your resolve. If he is right, maybe he'll save you (and others) a whole lot of future pain.

Just my opinion.

Yes totally agree. This is constructive opinion rather than no evident and basis to claim one of the reputable mints as shit like someone. Any motive behind ???? Very puzzke

andrewlee10

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #36 on: September 11, 2015, 09:20:50 PM »
Wow, I didn't realize the mints have been so busy, recently.  And if these medals have sold as well as reported, despite the high numismatic premium, it will surely inspire the minting of new medals, soon to be marketed.  Will the new money go to the next wave of private issues, or to drive up the numismatic premium of the current issues even more?  I'm not smart enough to play that trade, but I'm a more conservative, traditional investor, so I'll leave the the adrenaline chess match to others.




I break my small word. I hope this is my last sentence at this thread and end it.

Private investors are profit oriented which I assume. Why so many out with lower mintage as compare to fist coin mcc? This implied selling well and demand are there but someone can get it right.

Time will tell. This is the time from 79 to now told u demand of medal up. Why because many people use here to dumb. Definitely not......

Why not state and warn in pagoda and all other thread of China medal in the forum? Now the members who do not like medal Only do it for nanjing mints and nanjing panda  ?


barsenault

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #37 on: September 11, 2015, 09:41:11 PM »
It sure does appear that Chinese medals have set the world on fire.  The one below is inspired by the amazing craftsmanship of the Chinese.  Kudos to the forerunners of producing fine works of art - the Chinese mints - Private Investors. So much so, that we have other mints around the world following suit. Granted it is a coin, but an offshoot of the Chinese high relief medals.

"An initial glance over the images has you wondering how that depth is even possible, approaching that of some of the many amazing medallions issued in China by the Shanghai Mint which are actually cast, not struck."

http://agaunews.com/world-exclusive-look-max-relief-odin-coin-launches-choice-mint-legends-asgard-series/







Offline dynamike51

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #38 on: September 11, 2015, 11:33:02 PM »
A straightforward question to barsenault and andrewlee (in the spirit of full disclosure):

By appearance, you two seem to be very enthusiastic with medals, and your recent volume on CCF in this regard is self-evident. My question is: do you personally have any financial gain from promoting the medals ?

barsenault

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #39 on: September 11, 2015, 11:43:48 PM »
Hey dynamike.  Great question.  We have been abundantly clear on this forum, that we are first and foremost collectors.  And yes, as of late, Andy and I have started a website called Chinesemedals.com.  We've had the disclaimer on the bottom of our pages for months.  Yes, some of the medals we mention are on the site, but others are not (i.e. Odin).  We share a passion for Chinese medals and coins. I'm not sure what you mean by recent volume.  I've been posting pictures and videos of medals and coins, long before we started our website a month or so ago. We've only increased our volume in this thread, to answer some concerns about a particular mint or medal.

Offline dynamike51

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #40 on: September 11, 2015, 11:48:43 PM »
IMO, there are a lot of PRO-medal threads on CCF right now and, while it is a breath of fresh air to have them, it is also very important to have both views on medals on public record. The medal lovers (who are mostly new to MCC collecting?) seem to get so bothered when non-medal lovers provide an alternate opinion.

As far as I can tell, poconopenn is simply using his experience (and personal bias) to warn prospective investors/collectors/buyers about the potential perils of "investing" in medals, especially those (inferiorly) produced by what he believes to be mints with poor quality control and minimal experience. You do not need to be offended by his statements. On the contrary, you should investigate them. If he is wrong, you have lost nothing and this will strengthen your resolve. If he is right, maybe he'll save you (and others) a whole lot of future pain.

Just my opinion.

Ditto. +1

Offline Hippanda

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #41 on: September 12, 2015, 01:29:53 AM »
Hey dynamike.  Great question.  We have been abundantly clear on this forum, that we are first and foremost collectors.  And yes, as of late, Andy and I have started a website called Chinesemedals.com.  We've had the disclaimer on the bottom of our pages for months.  Yes, some of the medals we mention are on the site, but others are not (i.e. Odin).  We share a passion for Chinese medals and coins. I'm not sure what you mean by recent volume.  I've been posting pictures and videos of medals and coins, long before we started our website a month or so ago. We've only increased our volume in this thread, to answer some concerns about a particular mint or medal.

This is getting past comical Barsenault- You are doing it all wrong.  Don't try to further your wealth, in small cheap increments I should add,  by dissing a well-respected expert in the field Poconopenn who has been contributing here for way longer than you have been trying to make a poor man's nickel trying to pump cheaply made schlock. Your post elsewhere on a website of questionable character insulting and denegrating a valuable member of the Chinese Coin Collectors community here is very low, to call them out as "pomp and ego" is a low class move of you. Worse than stetching honesty past its breaking point, pushing these cheap medals for cheap gains stands out obviously as unseemly. Surely you can make the few bucks involved a bit more honestly, and honorably than this ?

These cheap, poorly made pieces of metal, and all the supposed wonderful high relief "masterpieces" you are pushing, are nothing more, really, than cheap Mexican velvet paintings.
Your high pressure sales tactics veiled as sincere excitement are a farce. These bear no relationship to quality coins and medals and have contrived rarity, and the pump to inflate their prices for gain of the distributors (you) should be embarrasing. Caveat emptor to newbies.

Mildly entertaining, but transparent.

You have a lot to learn, in life it seems.


Do I need to state "In my opinion" ? in order to protect my post?


Cheap schlock velvet paintings see bottom of ad : "Quality you can feel"  . Says it all.

Flame away on the site where dishonest pumpers are proven to be. But remember the old adage "He who sleeps with dogs, wakes up with fleas"

"He who speaks without modesty will find it difficult to make his words good."

Confucius

Offline comeaux

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #42 on: September 13, 2015, 11:57:34 AM »
This is getting past comical Barsenault- You are doing it all wrong.  Don't try to further your wealth, in small cheap increments I should add,  by dissing a well-respected expert in the field Poconopenn who has been contributing here for way longer than you have been trying to make a poor man's nickel trying to pump cheaply made schlock. Your post elsewhere on a website of questionable character insulting and denegrating a valuable member of the Chinese Coin Collectors community here is very low, to call them out as "pomp and ego" is a low class move of you. Worse than stetching honesty past its breaking point, pushing these cheap medals for cheap gains stands out obviously as unseemly. Surely you can make the few bucks involved a bit more honestly, and honorably than this ?

These cheap, poorly made pieces of metal, and all the supposed wonderful high relief "masterpieces" you are pushing, are nothing more, really, than cheap Mexican velvet paintings.
Your high pressure sales tactics veiled as sincere excitement are a farce. These bear no relationship to quality coins and medals and have contrived rarity, and the pump to inflate their prices for gain of the distributors (you) should be embarrasing. Caveat emptor to newbies.

Mildly entertaining, but transparent.

You have a lot to learn, in life it seems.


Do I need to state "In my opinion" ? in order to protect my post?


Cheap schlock velvet paintings see bottom of ad : "Quality you can feel"  . Says it all.

Flame away on the site where dishonest pumpers are proven to be. But remember the old adage "He who sleeps with dogs, wakes up with fleas"



Bravo !  :thumbup:

I agree that the cheap shots at poconopenn are uncalled for and classless, he has done way too much for collectors and this forum.

Offline trozau

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #43 on: September 13, 2015, 12:49:52 PM »
Hmmm... Looks like I missed all the drama.
trozau (troy ounce gold)
honi soit qui mal y pense

gold - the barbarous relic!

Offline fwang2450

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #44 on: September 13, 2015, 05:05:39 PM »
Hmmm... Looks like I missed all the drama.
Me too!

As someone who started on many medal topics, the Classical Garden series included, I would like anyone who intends to "invest" in recent medals to be extremely careful. I wrote in my blog that in terms of investment return, the top EARLY medals did not lose out to the top early silver coins. But with the massive number of privately commissioned new medals, there is no way to tell which will be the top ones. Artificially induced low mintage/rarity does not guarantee the medal to come out on top in the long run. In fact rarity does not count with recent issues because of the very obvious manipulation on the part of the sponsors. (This view goes against the hyping on some other site.) With new issues, profit comes from short term speculation, as some dealers/distributors are doing right now. If someone seeks long term investment gains with medals, go for the top early ones, from the 80's. Otherwise just enjoy the beauty of some of the recent issues (not the bald pandas though), forgetting about the price gain.