Author Topic: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal  (Read 20949 times)

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barsenault

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #15 on: September 11, 2015, 06:30:15 AM »
Yeah Pconopenn, what about it? lol.

Thanks for the info Andy.

Offline Birdman

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #16 on: September 11, 2015, 09:08:25 AM »
First, this is ugly and bald panda design by Nanjing mints which I totally agree. However, this is selling so well even there are few type of material used for this ugly and bald design panda. Why those collectors buy it and pay for high premium???? All of them loss of mind and no brainer?

This is a very interesting question.  There are several opinions that have been expressed in this and other threads.  Poconopenn can rest assured, however, knowing that he has openly expressed his concerns regarding this issue.  If someone still chooses to play the game on this and similar items, then that is their choice.  What is true is that someone will be making money.

barsenault

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2015, 09:25:18 AM »
It's no different with any other medal or coin Birdman.  Because one person deems it ugly doesn't mean everyone does.  One man's opinion is just that, an opinion.  I happen to like them, does that make me any more right or wrong than anyone else who thinks they are ugly? Nope.  But one does have to wonder about why such a negative vibe against one mint, when ALL the mints have their issues. Yes, they all do.  Have you taken a look at EVERY SINGLE 1st Panda Expo produced?  Terrible staining.  Terrible spots.  Does that mean the mint sucks big bags of dog poop, nope.  Yes, someone is making money, just like in the Pagodas, Pandas, Gold Fish, Classical Gardens, Mammoths, et...need I go on?  I think you guys need to check your biases at the door as much as we may need to.  Thanks.

Offline 1668Chris

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #18 on: September 11, 2015, 09:37:06 AM »
You like them because you are invested in them and selling them on your website.  There is a big difference in my mind btw white spots vs poor design.  Poconopenn speaks from years of experience and tremendous insight in the coin market.   N3 N3.   You should listen.


barsenault

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #19 on: September 11, 2015, 09:48:10 AM »
Who cares if we are selling them on our website?  We have lots of other stuff on the website. lol.  I happen to love the 2008's Banknotes too. And all the other stuff on the website. So what? That logic holds no weight.  He may be respected, but he's not an untouchable. What he says isn't the holy bible. We simply have to agree to disagree. As andy said, if these were so bad, and so horrible, and so ugly, and the quality was in the pooper, then these would have tanked.  The market speaks louder than you and the other naysayers.  And my bet is, there are many well seasoned folks from this site who have invested in this series...I know this to be a fact.  Are they dumb? Stupid? Wrong? Me don't thinks so.  But time will tell.

P.S. We've been very clear about being primarily collectors of coins and medals; but we are also selling.  Just as you probably use your own product, because you love it, but you are also meeting a need in the market place.  N27

Offline Birdman

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #20 on: September 11, 2015, 10:30:07 AM »
But time will tell.

Yes, time will tell.  In ten years (or some other time the future) we will be able to calmly check the history, updating this and other threads, and see how different investments have performed.  Some investments will be more successful than others.  All one can do at this point is listen to the various perspectives, weigh the pros and cons, and put your money where you think it has the most potential to grow (or where you just like the product, collect it, and don't care about the investment potential).  I can say that history shows that it is sometimes a great time to invest when market sentiment is very negative.  Sometimes not.

barsenault

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #21 on: September 11, 2015, 10:49:24 AM »
Amen Birdman.  I hope all of us making investments into the Chinese medals do well.  I wish no harm or ill-will toward others. Take care. Oh, and I'm sure I have some winners and some losers in my treasure chest...I do believe the Nanjing series will be a winner.  That's my opinion, and I'm sticking by it...not simply because I'm selling it...I collect it.  Just like others on this site who collect Pagodas, and may still have a set or two, but back in the day they sold a set or two for 25K.  It doesn't make them any less a collector than me. :-))

Offline SANDAC

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #22 on: September 11, 2015, 11:59:54 AM »
We simply have to agree to disagree.
That is the operative phrase.  I and poconopenn have had a number of differences of opinions, but I believe we had friendly and productive conversations and we agree to disagree at the end.  This is what CCF is about.  We are not expected to have identical thoughts at the beginning, middle, and end of a discussion.  Just because you have different opinions than the rest of the community doesn't mean you are wrong.  The big reason that the panda of the 1990's are so scarce and expensive is because China was a third-world country then and needed foreign currencies.  Panda were just bullions and no respectable collectors would collect them.  And varieties? well that's just manufacturing defects to be sneer at.  I bought several sheets of yr2000 silver panda at mostly bullion price and give them away as Chinese New Year and birthday gifts! 

Diversity of opinion is a good thing!

Offline Birdman

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #23 on: September 11, 2015, 12:31:30 PM »
Diversity of opinion is a good thing!

Yes, when we are all saying the same thing, and patting ourselves on the back about how right we are, that is when I'd start to worry.  At that point, the best bet might be to take a contrarian view.  When everybody is "drinking the same Kool-aid", it can be a bad thing.

barsenault

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #24 on: September 11, 2015, 12:53:04 PM »
Indeed.  Thanks much for the input Sandac and Birdman.  

Where I tend get a little worried, is when members think 'one man' can never be wrong...where the wisdom shared, is always faultless and error free...that's just as bad as group think.  I have felt at times there has been some back slapping, or group think, or folks rallying around a particular person (no particular person mentioned), because 'they've been around for years.'    

I do appreciate the spirited debates.  That's how folks learn, and make their own decisions on what is best for them. However, when a person is derided or looked down upon for disagreeing with a 'seasoned member' that's a problem.  

andrewlee10

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #25 on: September 11, 2015, 01:07:35 PM »
Read the comments again because of one medal and cited the mints as low quality.

Diff opinions are subways good but must constructive and prove it rather than just justify by one product of a mints and saying it is poor quality mints. Does this justify the facts ?

I am not the person who commission this nanjing panda but as I know it sell well. Only left cooper and silver are not many in the market now.

Readers here also realise if someone get question many will come out and Bomber the thread. Why and how and what this imply......

You guy can continue but time will prove. This do no good and no bad.

Why no one Bomber the pagoda thread once it was 25k when someone make the hype. It is 2 to 4 k now. Anyone warn readers? Anythings with risk and return which nothing can be sure win.

I only puzzle the reason of citing banjing mints is worst mints among other official mints in China due to the only one medal they produced. Is this fair and justify ..... Reader eyes are clear. Time will proof. This my last sentence here. You guy ca. Happily continue and i decide express no opinion of this thread. Otherwise I will get bomber again and people will prolong guessing my intention and objective.

Offline Mirkkanen

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #26 on: September 11, 2015, 01:23:51 PM »
IMO, there are a lot of PRO-medal threads on CCF right now and, while it is a breath of fresh air to have them, it is also very important to have both views on medals on public record. The medal lovers (who are mostly new to MCC collecting?) seem to get so bothered when non-medal lovers provide an alternate opinion.

As far as I can tell, poconopenn is simply using his experience (and personal bias) to warn prospective investors/collectors/buyers about the potential perils of "investing" in medals, especially those (inferiorly) produced by what he believes to be mints with poor quality control and minimal experience. You do not need to be offended by his statements. On the contrary, you should investigate them. If he is wrong, you have lost nothing and this will strengthen your resolve. If he is right, maybe he'll save you (and others) a whole lot of future pain.

Just my opinion.

barsenault

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #27 on: September 11, 2015, 01:33:05 PM »
^^^^

 N31   N31   N31   :thumbup: :thumbup:

Offline Birdman

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #28 on: September 11, 2015, 03:44:57 PM »
Why no one Bomber the pagoda thread once it was 25k when someone make the hype. It is 2 to 4 k now. Anyone warn readers?

A good question.

Just want to present the records and the truth. If my memory serve me correct, birdman and SANDC were not the moderator during the period from June 15, 2011 to Aug. 26, 2011. At that time, the only moderator was located in H.K. and ex-administrator had total control of this forum. This seller and ex-administrator were banned permanently from this Forum at the same time.

http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=3181.0 (June 15, 2011)

1989 3.3 oz silver God of War and Wealth clouded claw NCS NGC PF 69 UC
Ebay/PayPal price: $6200
check/money order price: $5650
cash price: $5150
NCS conserved. Population estimate less than 200. Rarely seen investment grade.

http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=3424.0 (July 8, 2011)

1989 3.3 oz silver God of War and Wealth clouded claw NCS NGC PF 69 UC
Ebay/PayPal price: $6200
check/money order price: $5650
cash price: $5150
Population estimate less than 200. Rarely seen investment grade.

http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=3452.0 (July 12, 2011)

1989 3.3 oz silver God of War and Wealth clouded claw NCS NGC PF 69 UC
Ebay/PayPal price: $6200
check/money order price: $5650
cash price: $5150
Population estimate less than 200. Rarely seen investment grade

http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=3725.0 (Aug. 15, 2011)

1984 20 g silver ancient pagoda temple 4 coin set NCS NGC PF 68 UC
Ebay/PayPal price: $14,000
check/money order price: $12,500
cash price: $10,000
Mintage 260, many melted.

1984 20 g silver ancient pagoda temple 4 coin set NCS NGC PF 69 UC
Ebay/PayPal price: $31,000
check/money order price: $28,500
cash price: $26,000
Mintage 260, many melted.

http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=3811.0 (Aug. 26, 2011)

1984 20 g silver ancient pagoda temple 4 coin set NCS NGC PF 68 UC
Ebay/PayPal price: $14,000
check/money order price: $12,500
cash price: $10,000
Mintage 260, many melted.

1984 20 g silver ancient pagoda temple 4 coin set NCS NGC PF 69 UC
Ebay/PayPal price: $31,000
check/money order price: $28,500
cash price: $26,000
Mintage 260, many melted.

Others please correct me if I have the historical facts wrong, but:

There was essentially one person controlling the forum during the pagoda hype.  As I understanding it, many who are active in their warnings now were abstaining from participating in the forum then, in protest to how things were run.  They didn't want to be associated with unsavory aspects.  Although their decision not to participate in the forum prevented their good name from giving an air of legitimacy to the forum, conversely, it essentially left the fox guarding the hen house.  When the ex-administrator was banned, however, then a number of quality, knowledgeable people returned to participate in the forum.  I think they have the mentality now of: "never again will we let such a thing happen to this forum"  Hence their current vigilance.

Online pandamonium

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Re: 2 varieties of the Nanjing mint panda 2014 copper medal
« Reply #29 on: September 11, 2015, 04:22:25 PM »
Sadly there will not be another silver pagoda debate, due to controls put into place.    Demand was so low the dealers could not sell them so trades were accepted.   New information has come out on them so they should eventually rebound very well.   Opportunities like that, maybe once in a life time.   In a short time frame, bullion has to break to the upside and China's love of MCC can only increase as stocks, real estate, etc take a face plant.   Wish there was passion and anger for another early year MCC coin or medal so i can bottom fish.   Alas, those days are passed.........