Chinese Coins Forum

Features => China Imperial & Republic => Yuan Shih Kai Dollar => Topic started by: KONDi on November 09, 2011, 01:34:35 AM

Title: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on November 09, 2011, 01:34:35 AM
Dear coin collectors and coin dealers,

Today I would like to share with information about my research on common fatman dollar 1914. Every more experienced collector knows that YSK 1914 it is common coin. But now every one knows that there are some rare variety of YSK dollar dated 1914. So this what I am going to share with you right now. So have a sit comfortable in your arm chair take a cup of coffee if you will ready this late a night and enjoy readying:)

picture 1.
This YSK fatman dollar when we take a look on the obverse was issued in 1914 according to the date on the coin. However according to some information which I found this coin with mint mark "O"(letter "O") in a ribbon knot was very rare coin till 1980, after 1980's many of the came up on the market. Even that it is still rare then common fatman 1914. Some information also said that it was issued between 1948-49 and later got out of circulation. Mint mark with letter "O" according to other information which I have indicates Tianjin Central Mint. But I can't confirm it. This is just my speculation. Except different not connected part of chinese character "yuan", mint mark "O" and longer grain of a leaf of the right side of the reverse. This coin has double ear. This variety called double ear YSK 1914 with mint mark "O". Rare.

picture 2.
This one is our common YSK 1914 dollar.

picture 3.
Gansu (Kansu) variety of YSK 1914. According to: http://home.netvigator.com/~ykleungn/yuansk3.htm
This coin was issued in 1921 or later and it was circulated at a discount in the Republic period,cause it has low silver content (about 60-70% content of silver). I also found some other information that it was issued in 1930's. It is hard to say when exactly. But this one is rarer than common YSK 1914
dollar on picture 2 for sure. It has double eyebrow, bigger head, different shape of chinese characters on the obverse when you will compare them to the one on picture 2. The shape of that part with stars is also different. One the reverse 2 chinese character "yi yuan" are also in a different shape. Leaves are little more clear than on common fatman 1914 from the picture nr 2.

picture 4.
People from Gansu (Kansu) variety of YSK 1914. On the obverse all chinese characters looks more thiner then on picture 3. If you take a look closer you can even say that they are crude. Teeth on the obverse also looks like they are made in crude way. Hair are more visuable than on the one from picture 3. The part wit stars also look thiner and more clear. On the reverse 2 chinese characters "yi yuan" looks similar to the one on picture 3. Very rare!

picture 5.
Wuchang is a city in China. This variety which I would like to show you on picture nr 5 if from Wuchang. On the obverse the 3rd chinese character has small part which is shorter than on common YSK 1914 from picture 2. Also a part of the ribbon on the reverse on the left side has like 2 branches. Those 2 things are characteristic for Wuchang variety of YSK 1914. But what else? Well as you can notice, Wuchang variety has fatter rim: 39.5mm in diameter. Rare.

picture 6.
Hook variety of YSK 1914 dollar. This one is a rare type thanks to the hook, which is located on the reverse on the right side close to the center ribbon.


picture 7.
The rarest variety with all YSK dollars 1914 is Shandong. It was issued in Shandong province by warlord. This variety is much rarer than Xinjiang variety. The shape of eyes is characteristic, hair, which looks like Yuan has little less hair. The part with stars is also in different shape. Very characteristic thing for Shandong variety is 2nd chinese character "yuan". This is the rarest variety among all YSK 1914 dollars. Very very rare type.

picture 8.
On the reverse of this variety of YSK dollar 1914 we can see that 2 grains od leaves downstairs are crossed. This variety called crossed grains variety of YSK 1914. Rare.

picture 9.
YSK dollar 1914 with mint mark "O". This variety has a part of second character "yuan" not connected on the reverse. Mustache on the obverse are not so clear as we as the part of Yuan's uniform. Eyes look like calm but clear. Teeth on the left side of the obverse look like they would have small balls shape. This variety called not connected "yuan" character of YSK 1914 with mith mark "O". It also has longer granis on the reverse on the right side. Rare type.

picture 10.
Xinjiang (Sinkiang) variety of YSK dollar 1914. I was made in Xinjiang province. Some information says that there are north and south varieties from Xinjiang. All Xinjiang varieties has from 26,7g-27,2g weight, diameter is 39,5mm. Silver content: 40-50%. They are all made in crude way. This one has not clear part with stars and characteristic eye's shape on the obverse. On the reverse it has close first
chinese character "yi" one leaf is crossed with long grain. Also on the right side on the character "yuan" there are 3-4 grains. But this is what I see is actually 5 granis on the right side on character "yuan", one is hidden in another. Rare type, much more rarer than Gansu variety on picture 3. It was issued by warlord.

picture 11.
The 3rd variety of "O" mint mark YSK 1914. This one has more clear mustache on the obverse, different way of look (eye looks different) then on picture 9. The part of Yuan's uniform is more clear than on the one from picture 9. The part with stars is also clear but only stars I think. On the reverse leaves are more clear, a part of character "yuan" is connected and creats triangular shape. Letter "O", the mint mark is not so clear as on picture 9. The grain on the right side one of leaf is longer than on the one from picture 9.Rare type.

picture 12.
This is Tibet variety, a restrike made in 1950's by chinese communists. They were all made in Szechuan province to pay workers for building the road in Tibet. On the obverse stars part is very clear teeth upstairs are very small and not so easy to notice. Other parts like hair, eye and mustache are also not clear. The part in 1st chinese character is much thiner than on the one from picture 2. On the reverse second chinese character "yuan" is connected creats traingular shape and leaves are more clear. There are 2 varieties of this YSK 1914 Tibet restrike. Rare then common YSK 1914 on picture 2.

picture 13.
Double pen variety of YSK 1914. On the obverse of this one we can notice that 4th chinese character has like 2 lines inside missing or not co clear when you look on it for a first time. When you will take a look closer you can see that first line is divided on 2 which looks like a pen and the second one also but it is not so clear as the first line. One the reverse the second chinese character "yuan" is thiner then on YSK 1914 on picture 2. Double pen variety is rarer than common YSK 1914 on picture 2.

picture 14.
The reverse of this variety of YSK 1914 has 1 grain of one leaf which is more clear on the right side. Also a fundamental part of character "yuan" is thiner than on the one on picture 2. Rare.

picture 15.
Bold variety of YSK 1914 from Gansu province. This one looks similar to the one on picture nr 3. However when we will take a look closer we can notice that all 6 characters on obverse are bold. Rarer than Gansu variety 1914 on picture 3, but not so rare as People from Gansu variety on picture 4.

picture 16.
This variety of YSK 1914 is very interesting. It looks similar to year 8 (1919) of fatman dollar. I mean some part like the part with stars, hair, shape of eye. But when I took a look on all my YSK 1919 which I have for sale I didn't find even one which has a part of 3rd character is the same shape of hook and the last chinese character in a bow shape. I think it is very interesting and rare variety of YSK 1914. Rare for sure.

picture 17.
Yunnan variety of YSK dollar 1914. All 6 chinese characters looks different than those on YSK 1914 from picture 2. The bust of Yuan is not clear. The teeth are little smaller on the obverse. 2 chinese characters "yi yuan" are both bold.Very rare.

picture 18a and 18b
Those are both varieties of YSK 1914 from Xinjiang province. They are both different. On the obverse of 18a 1st character is bigger than on the one from picture 18b. Eyes are in different shape. Nose from 18a on obverse is longer but nose on 18b on obverse is the same size with mustache. The part with stars is more clear on 18b than on 18a on obverse. The 4th chinese character on 18a on obverse is shorter but on 18b is taller. On reverse of both, 18a has 3 grains on the right side of the character "yuan" and on 18b there are 4 grains. on 18a a part of the character "yi" has small hook and the left side of character "yuan" is moved a little bit to inside. Those 2 character are different from the Xinjiang variety of picture 10. Both are rarer than Gansu variety on picture 3.

picture 19.
This is private variety, probably made by some less known warlord. It has 26,5g weight. On the obverse you can notice that shape all 6 characters are different than on the one from picture 2. Also shape of eye is different. On the reverse both characters, especially character "yuan" has different shape. Rare and interesting!

picture 20.
This is also private variety, but made by other warlord. Shape of eye is different than on picture 19. All 6 chinese characters looks different than on the one from picture 19. Ear is in different shape and stars part. It has also some line which goes behind Yuan's head. On the reverse leaves and 2 chinese characters are made in crude way. Rare and also interesting. This one has also 26,5g of weight.

picture 21.
On the reverse of this variety of YSK 1914 we can see that on the right side. One grain of a leaf is crossed with another leaf. Rare type.

picture 22.
Another private variety which was made by warlord probably. Crude made all 6 chinese characters on obverse. Eye is not clear and also part with stars. The part with stars is also the smallest with all varieties of YSK 1914 dollar. On the reverse hair are made in crude way not so clear as well as 2
chinese characters. Rare. It has 26,7g weight, silver content 8,5%.

picture 23.
This is my favorite private variety of YSK 1914. It has northwest style and it is overweight,has 28,5g weight and only 8% of silver content. It has different shape of ear, eye. All chinese characters on obverse are made in crude way. Teeth on right side and also downstairs are in some distance from the rim of the coin. On the reverse leaves are clear and 2 chinese characters are made in crude way. Beautiful and the only one so far I saw and own.

picture 24.
Another one private variety. Look on the shape of all 6 chinese characters on obverse, especially 6th one. Ear is bigger, much bigger. Eye shape it is like Yuan is very old, which makes me think it was made after his death, after 1916. The part with stars very clear. Leaves on reverse and 2 chinese characters are not so clear. Weight of this coin: 24,5g and silver content 8%. Rare type.

picture 25.
This variety of YSK dollar 1914 has on reverse very clear grain of one leaf on the right side and also fatter leaf on the left side (which i very clear). Rare.

picture 26.
Gansu (Kansu) variety of YSK 1914. The most expensive one with all YSK 1914 varieties. It has 2 extra chinese characters on right and left side of obverse means made in Gansu or Gansu. Also downstairs it has like double teeth, except of those close to a rim. Very rare one.

picture 27.
And finally the lost one. This one is another Tibet variety of YSK 1914. A restrike which was made by Chinese communists in 1950's in Szechuan province for workers who were building a road in Tibet. This variety is 2nd variety. Except that teeth upstairs on the obverse are shorter, hair are not so clear, aslo mustache. Not clear is also part with stars. Sometimes it has small dot behind the ear but dot could be made by die. I have also seen the same type without dot. The first chinese character has thiner part. On the reverse leaves are more clear. Character "yuan" is in triangular shape.

That's all. Thanks for reading. I hope you enjoyed it. If you will find some new variety of YSK 1914 please share and post picture here and write what makes it so special then others.
I do hope my research will help many coin collectors here to discover the beauty of their common YSK 1914 dollar. Good luck. Now go to your Fatman dollars 1914 and check maybe you have rare type...
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on November 09, 2011, 01:37:31 AM
other photos... :001_rolleyes:
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Birdman on November 09, 2011, 08:05:18 AM
Thanks, Kondi.  I'll definitely be referring to this in the future.  Interesting stuff.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: dragondollar on November 14, 2011, 04:38:24 AM
Nice article :) I wonder about the rarity of the 双O版 (double O) relative to the scarcest presented in this article? I have only one, and rarely saw it on the market.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: gxseries on November 26, 2011, 09:01:17 AM
Very nice writeup Kondi. Thank you
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: tkcoin on December 09, 2011, 12:35:29 AM
too many varieties may kill variety.
the ones that sales are the "triangel yuan" and the "O" types of verieties.
Recently I heard some noice about "open eye" or "shut eye".
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on December 09, 2011, 05:18:22 AM
Dear tkcoin,

Could you tell me something more about "open eye" and "shut eye" varieties??
That's very ineresting. Can you post some pictures of those 2 which you mentioned?
Thanks in advance!
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on December 19, 2011, 02:51:31 AM
Dear coin collectors and coin dealers,

I found another Hook variety of YSK 1914 dollar. This one is little better condition. Just for reference.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: r3globe on December 19, 2011, 12:11:50 PM
Hi Kondi, please look at this fatman dollar? Is this a variety? value? Thanks.

Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: dragondollar on December 19, 2011, 06:06:47 PM
That's a Gansu dollar, this one. And a pretty nice one!
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on December 20, 2011, 12:54:32 AM
Indeed, this is Gansu dollar. Very beautiful condition! And it is graded! by National Numismatic Certification if I am not wrong. This is not common Gansu dollar 1914, but bold variety, which is more rare than common Gansu. Please read description above to Picture nr 15 and also take a look on photo. I have one such of coin for sale. In raw it costs 180 USD. Yours is graded so it is worth 270 USD.
I found one also graded by National Numismatic Certification but common Gansu type 1914 with mark XF 40 for 560 USD some chinese coin collector who I know is selling. But is is common one, yours is bold variety so it could be more rare. I would give if I would be buying 270 USD for this piece. Beautiful coin!
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: r3globe on January 01, 2012, 02:41:57 PM
Hi Kondi, Happy new year! Here is anothr fatman dollar I want you to look at? Also, please look at this Junk Dollar and tell me what you think? Thank youuuuuuuu!
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on January 02, 2012, 01:26:35 AM
First one is common fatman 1914. I didn't find anything special on the surface of this coin. It is I believe in VG-F condition. I would pay for it 145 USD the most if I would be buying it.
About your Junk dollar 1934, it is also common. Condition is VF-XF, price 150 USD the most for this coin.
BTW, Happy New 2012 Year also for you!:)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Birdman on January 02, 2012, 06:55:41 AM
First one is common fatman 1914. I didn't find anything special on the surface of this coin. It is I believe in VG-F condition. I would pay for it 145 USD the most if I would be buying it.
About your Junk dollar 1934, it is also common. Condition is VF-XF, price 150 USD the most for this coin.
BTW, Happy New 2012 Year also for you!:)

In checking recent sales on US eBay I see an NGC AU55 1914 dollar sold for $153.50 yesterday.  If you might be paying close to that amount for an ungraded VG-F does that mean that the market in China is paying more for these coins?

ebay 270879968360
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NGC-AU-55-China-1914-Republic-Silver-Dollar-1-/270879968360?pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item3f11b44c68#ht_990wt_899

Similarly, an NGC AU58 sold for $131.50 yesterday on US eBay, so paying $150 for a VF-XF has me wondering if these coins are getting scarcer in China or if demand is increasing?

ebay 220920024771
http://www.ebay.com/itm/NGC-AU-58-China-1934-Republic-Silver-Dollar-1-/220920024771?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item336fdc0ec3#ht_990wt_899

Birdman
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: r3globe on January 07, 2012, 04:42:57 PM
Hi Kondi, Here is another 1914 Fatman I just bought. This one seems to have more details!! Do you see any variety there? Thank you :)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on January 08, 2012, 05:36:08 AM
Dear r3globe,

On the beginning when I saw this your new YSK dollar 1914 I thought it is genuine one. But after close examination I must say it is FAKE coin. Yes, there are many details like more visible hair and part with stars, but this is not genuine piece and I will give my head for it. The hair are one of the crucial point which betrays this coin. I haven't seen such of second YSK dollar 1914 with so clear hair. The hair are clear on other common YSK dollars 1914 but not so clear. Let's take a look on close photo one of my YSK 1914 with mint mark "O" it has similar design like the hair on your fatman dollar 1914. But your is not "O" variety, just common. Besides, on my YSK 1914 ear is double and shape of stars part is different than on yours YSK 1914. So your coin can't be the same one with the coin on picture 1a. I also compared your YSK 1914 with one of my YSK 1914 which I have. The hair are similar, but not the same. However the part with stars on your YSK 1914 is not the same as the stars part on my YSK 1914. So my coin (picture 2a) is not the same with your coin. Now my coin from picture 3a. The hair are the same (nearly the same I must say once again) but stars part doesn't match with your coin. Also on reverse of my coins (picture 3b) there is no "O" mint mark. On your coin I also don't see it but I also don't see clear on leaf which getting out of one grain on the right side. So your coins is
not 3a-3b coin. 4a it is obverse of my YSK 1920, hair are clear, stars part is clear but not the same looking as on your coin + my coin is 1920 while yours is 1914.

Now the most interesting part of my analysis.

1. On the obverse there is some inner dot. Also on the ear of Yuan Shih Kai. I marked those both things in red color on your coin. There are also 2 on rim, with little different shape. I don't think those are made by some kind of mechanical damage. It is made during producing process. I didn't see similar inner dots on any of my common YSK 1914 and believe me I have seen a lot of YSK dollars 1914 already.
2. A collar looks not clear and not natural, while stars part is quite clear.
3. The surface on obverse and reverse looks rough, like it would have some pitting, which means that the coin has 99% chances to be fake. Unless this is YSK 1914 Xinjiang issued. But that's different design than common YSK 1914. I marked 2 such of rough areas on obverse and reverse on your coin.
4. I believe 3 thin teeth are missing on the end of Yuan's uniform on obverse. Of course they also could be covered by dirt.
5. The 5th chinese character on the obverse of your coin is not clear enough, little blur. Why only this one? why the other are clear? Let's take a look on picture of my coin, picture nr 6a. On my coin you can see that 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th chinese character---they are all not clear. Also part with hair, part with stars and the downstairs part of Yuan's uniform, the are all not clear. Which is normal effect of circulation of this coin, but on your coin: hair are clear, part with stars is clear all 5 chinese characters are clear only this one is not clear.
6. 6th chinese character on obverse of your coin is not fully connected. The downstairs part of 6th character is not connected, it could be also covered by dirt that's why I see it as not connected. However the last chinese character is only not connected on YSK dollar dated 1921 and it is variety. Take a look on closer picture C and D.

That's all about obverse of your coin now reverse...

7. On reverse of your YSK 1914 upstairs (picture A) between rim and small and big teeth there are some strange 2 thin lines. There are no such of lines on genuine coin. Also there are 2 thin lines on rim upstairs on reverse of your coin: just 2 thin lines on rim (picture B). And there is some strange line between the rim and both: thin and big teeth on reverse of left side. This is not right. Please take a look on picture 5a, see the rim of this YSK 1914 and thin and bigger teeth are composited---they are like match to each other. Of course there is double rim on genuine pieces of YSK 1914 but doesn't look like this.

Summarize, your coin is NOT GENUINE coin. You can still take a risk and send this fatman 1914 to NGC but I wouldn't do this. I would return this coin to seller and ask for refund of my money.

Hey, why don't you buy some coin from me. You wouldn't have to worry + I have good pieces! Please check Buy, Sell and Trade section to find my old chinese coins for sell every moth---every year!:)

KONDi
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: r3globe on January 09, 2012, 09:52:52 AM
Hi Kondi, Thank you so much for your help. Your advice is very valuable. I will return the coin to the seller. I will keep checking the coins you have for sale. Thanks again :)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on January 11, 2012, 05:11:08 AM
You are always welcome!:)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: arunpkrishnan on November 18, 2012, 02:22:48 PM
Hello.. Can you please tell me the authenticity, variety, rarity of this particular coin? I picked it up from ebay for 62 dollars. I hope its not a fake.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: PCGS-ASIA on November 18, 2012, 10:34:45 PM
KONDi:

When I have TIME (lol) I intend to work up the varieties we currently recognize so we can compare.....

I don't want to start with 1914 though!  Too many - last count we recognize about 40 different ones.

I'll try to start with 1921.  Either way, it will be interesting....
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on November 19, 2012, 06:49:35 AM
Dear arunpkrishnan,

Unfortunately, this is a fake piece:(
Please take a look on a surface of your YSK dollar 1914---obverse. It has some small dots, which looks like grains of sand. About the part of a rim, it looks like someone took a knife and split it into 2 pieces.
On a reverse the rim looks very sharp, which is also not natural. The color of this coin doesn't look right. For me it is silver-plated metal. Did you try to use magnet. If this coin sticks to magnet it is silver-plated metal---very low class fake. Which by the way looks like such of coin for me.
Such of fake should weight 19-22g. I hope you can get your money back from a seller.

Best wishes,

from Shanghai...

KONDi
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: marbury518 on December 08, 2012, 10:22:21 AM
I just picked these two coins up in Czech Republic. One is the common variety to my untrained eye and the other is the traingle version. Any info on interesting features appreciated. i imagine Kondi and Dragon Dollar might have something to say at the very least. They look pretty good grades but will probably end up sending to NGC. Enjoy.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: marbury518 on December 09, 2012, 03:02:04 AM
Looks like possible faint circle in left hand quarter of bow but maybe just a shadow.....
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: dragondollar on December 09, 2012, 04:52:13 AM
The pictures are not high resolution enough to see if this is a weak-O/triangle yuan. For me, I see a regular 1914 YSK dollar and a triangle yuan. Both are in good AU condition.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: PCGS-ASIA on December 09, 2012, 12:36:46 PM
The triangle yuan looks like what we call "bold leaves" variety.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: marbury518 on December 09, 2012, 01:37:12 PM
So is that good or bad? Thanks.......marbury
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: PCGS-ASIA on December 09, 2012, 02:21:24 PM

I would say they are significantly scarcer.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: marbury518 on December 11, 2012, 04:03:43 PM
A well known dealer in the USA said that although it is a better rare variety the condition isn't great.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on December 16, 2012, 10:42:34 AM
Dear marbury518,

I have already answered on your email about those 2 coins on 1st December. But I will repeat what I wrote:

Frist one is common YSK dollar 1914. I didn't find anything special in this coin.

But the second coin is little more rare and worth to bid, see this post and read describtion below picture 12---compare photos.
 
http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=4460.0

picture 12.

I just picked these two coins up in Czech Republic. One is the common variety to my untrained eye and the other is the traingle version. Any info on interesting features appreciated. i imagine Kondi and Dragon Dollar might have something to say at the very least. They look pretty good grades but will probably end up sending to NGC. Enjoy.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: marbury518 on December 18, 2012, 08:38:28 AM
Triangle O up for sale..........1914...........does it look bona fide?

Says cleaned unfortunately.

Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on February 17, 2013, 10:30:22 PM
Dear all,

I discovered new YSK variety recently. On picture nr 28 you can see another private version of YSK silver dollar from 1914. So what is characteristic for this variety? Well, on the obverse you can see that the way of Yuan Shih Kai is looking and direction where is looking is different compare to the other private varieties. Also under his eye that part (I don't know how to call it) it is fatter and bigger than on other varieties. I also think that on his ear, that lower part of his ear (the part which women pierce to wear earrings) is a little bit fatter. The edge is thiner than on the other YSK private varieties. This variety doesn't have a name. It weights only 26,01g and diameter is 39mm. Rare type.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: gerald on February 17, 2013, 11:21:58 PM
I'll help with the name - "baggy eye and fat ear lobe" variety :)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on February 17, 2013, 11:34:06 PM
Dear gerald,

Thank you for your help:)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: gerald on February 17, 2013, 11:53:53 PM
KONDi - thank you for starting this thread, it is immensely interesting :)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on February 18, 2013, 01:05:44 AM
Dear gerald,

You are welcome! The pleasure is always on my side:)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: happycoins II on February 18, 2013, 01:40:55 AM
Interesting findings. However, still wondering what it would look like in a mint condition (which would show us a clearer picture of the variety)? :(
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: poconopenn on February 18, 2013, 10:42:16 AM
Interesting findings. However, still wondering what it would look like in a mint condition (which would show us a clearer picture of the variety)? :(

+1

It is dangerous to claim the discovery of a new variety when the coin itself is in VG-F condition. Based on the picture of reedings, the chance of this coin being fake is greater than being a new variety.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on February 18, 2013, 11:52:59 AM
Dear all,

I realize that some varieties of YSK dollar 1914, 1920 or 1921 are the first time when you have seen them in your life. Nowadays we have to stay alert because there are too many fakes. Many private YSK varieties which I introduced are less likely that you will find them in some numismatic literature.

However you have to know that most of all those private varieties are crudely made, contains less per cent of silver, weight much less than general issued YSK silver dollars.

As an example I would like to give Xinjiang variety of YSK 1914 dollar. Now it is well known among collectors, because we have literature where we can find this coin, because it recognizable by international coin collectors, not only chinese coin collectors and because PCGS/NGC graded such of pieces:
http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=2289.0

Which one of you wouldn't say that that Xinjiang variety of YSK 1914 have a chance of being fake than being new variety?? Without all of those above. Which one of you have seen ever Xinjiang variety graded by PCGS/NGC with mark higher than XF or AU. These are crudely made coins, it is hard to find them in better condition and also those are private issued pieces appearance is different than those general issued YSK 1914.

Those private varieties which I discribed are not recognizable by international coin collectors yet, because all of those reasons which I mentioned with Xinjiang vatiety, but one day they might be discovered in numismatic books.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: poconopenn on February 21, 2013, 04:26:00 PM
The first step to identify the genuine 1914 Fat Man is looking for the hidden mark. There is a thicker dentil at nine clock of reverse as shown in the attached three pictures. The pictures were copied from Marbury518 posted in Reply 27 and 29.

After close examination of KNODi’s post at the beginning of this thread, the coins in pictures 1, 2, 5, 8, 11, 13, 20, 21, 25, 27 have this hidden mark while the coins in Picture 3, 4, 7, 9, 12, 17, 18a, 19 and 24 do not have and may not be genuine. The coins did not mention above are hard to tell, since the dentil is not visible.

All 7 eBay current listings of NGC and PCGS and ANAC graded 1914 fat man coin have the hidden mark as mentioned above.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/CHINA-1914-DOLLAR-YUAN-SHIH-KAI-RARE-COIN-SILVER-FAT-MAN-NGC-AU58-L-KS-UNC-L-K-/190796382021?pt=US_World_Coins&hash=item2c6c59bf45

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1914-CHINA-REPUBLIC-FAT-MAN-YUAN-SHIH-KAI-SILVER-DOLLAR-Y-329-L-M-63-PCGS-VF30-/281053763739?pt=US_World_Coins&hash=item41701c189b

http://www.ebay.com/itm/CHINA-REPUBLIC-1914-Yr3-1-Dollar-Silver-Crown-NGC-AU-53-E8-/230896875983?pt=US_World_Coins&hash=item35c286b9cf

http://www.ebay.com/itm/CHINA-1914-1-REPUBLIC-OF-CHINA-Y-329-PCGS-MS-61-FAT-MAN-Yuan-Shih-Kai-/290853721415?pt=US_World_Coins&hash=item43b83b9547

http://www.ebay.com/itm/CHINA-1914-1-REPUBLIC-OF-CHINA-Y-329-PCGS-AU-DETAIL-FAT-MAN-/290859708131?pt=US_World_Coins&hash=item43b896eee3

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1914-CHINA-SILVER-DOLLAR-YUAN-SHIH-KAI-FAT-MAN-ANACS-AU-53-/121068829927?pt=US_World_Coins&hash=item1c3043bce7

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1914-CHINA-REPUBLIC-FAT-MAN-YUAN-SHIH-KAI-SILVER-DOLLAR-Y-329-L-M-63-PCGS-XF40-/290847853956?pt=US_World_Coins&hash=item43b7e20d84
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: mook on February 22, 2013, 03:20:19 PM
Thanks Poconopenn,Kondi, very interesting N31
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on March 08, 2013, 11:04:01 AM
Dear poconopenn,

According to that what you said:

"The first step to identify the genuine 1914 Fat Man is looking for the hidden mark. There is a thicker dentil at nine clock of reverse as shown in the attached three pictures. The pictures were copied from Marbury518 posted in Reply 27 and 29."

you got wrong by judging that my coin may be questionable. That the surface of my coin is not right for any genuine coin.
http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=4399.0
Because my fatman 1921 has this hidden mark.

Answering your other argument where you showed us photos copied from Marbury518 posted in Reply 27 and 29.
Those photos are not clear enough and have small resolution.

About those coins: 3, 4, 7, 9, 12, 17, 18a, 19 and 24 which you judged they do not have any hidden mark and may not be genuine.
First of all nr 3 and nr 4 are Gansu varieties, and on this more common (nr 3) you won't find this hidden mark as also on this more rare (nr 4):
http://www.ebay.com/itm/KANSU-PCGS-AU-53-1914-China-Kansu-Silver-Dollar-1-About-Uncirculated-/370766026646?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&_trkparms=aid%3D222002%26algo%3DSIC.FIT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D14293%26meid%3D5915101738041857759%26pid%3D100011%26prg%3D1095%26rk%3D2%26sd%3D181085764233%26&nma=true&si=wW2aKEdTEsNtSNlHOGyYVtCrexA%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

All those links from ebay which you provided us shows graded YSK dollar 1914 BUT general issued by Tianjin Central Mint AND those all have this hidden mark.

On nr 7, 9 and 12 that part is not clear I would have to check it first do I have still those coins.

Nr 17, 19 and 24 are all private issued, they don't have this hidden mark.

Nr 18a --- it is Sinkiang variety (Xinjiang variety) of YSK 1914:
http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=2289.0
These as also nr 3 and 4 from Gansu don't have hidden mark.

I am not sure about first link which you showed us:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/CHINA-1914-DOLLAR-YUAN-SHIH-KAI-RARE-COIN-SILVER-FAT-MAN-NGC-AU58-L-KS-UNC-L-K-/190796382021?pt=US_World_Coins&hash=item2c6c59bf45
I can't review all photos (reverse of this coin).

Anyway the hidden mark is not the only point to judge that coin is genuine or not.

Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: poconopenn on March 09, 2013, 12:10:35 PM
Dear poconopenn,

First of all nr 3 and nr 4 are Gansu varieties, and on this more common (nr 3) you won't find this hidden mark as also on this more rare (nr 4):
http://www.ebay.com/itm/KANSU-PCGS-AU-53-1914-China-Kansu-Silver-Dollar-1-About-Uncirculated-/370766026646?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&_trkparms=aid%3D222002%26algo%3DSIC.FIT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D14293%26meid%3D5915101738041857759%26pid%3D100011%26prg%3D1095%26rk%3D2%26sd%3D181085764233%26&nma=true&si=wW2aKEdTEsNtSNlHOGyYVtCrexA%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc


Your coins in picture 3 & 4 in the first post of this thread have significantly differences in Chinese characters from PCGS graded coin as show in  the attached enlarged section pictures. The first Chinese character in you coin in picture 3 is typical for common 1914 YSK, not known to be as Kansu coin. The coin in you picture 4 is definitely a low quality fake.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: poconopenn on March 09, 2013, 12:47:08 PM
Dear poconopenn,

Nr 18a --- it is Sinkiang variety (Xinjiang variety) of YSK 1914:
http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=2289.0

Attached is enlarged section pictures of PCGS XF Xinjiang YSK vs. you coin in picture 18a. See the differences in Chinese characters. IMO, this is also a fake.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: G.Lewis on April 04, 2013, 05:16:05 AM
I have come across a Fatman dollar and I have done quite a bit of searching and cannot find one like the one I have found. It has a rectangle to the right with some chinese characters in, I'm afraid I know absolutely no Chinese so I can't translate. Any ideas what it might be? I've attached a couple of photos beneath...
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on April 04, 2013, 05:40:49 AM
Dear G.Lewis,

The first time I read about it here:
http://home.netvigator.com/~ykleungn/yuansk2.htm

It is Yuan Shih Kai silver dollar from 1914 with counterstamp made probably in 1934 by Chinese Soviets.
In SCWC 1901-2000 it is K#650k. The counterstamp in Chinese means "SOVIET".
This is extremely rare coin. I have never seen genuine piece. This coin which you showed us on those 2 pictures in not genuine piece.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: G.Lewis on April 04, 2013, 06:11:53 AM
Aah okay. Thank you for getting back to me so quickly. I've done a little looking around about the soviet stamped ones and it's all very interesting. Are these fakes common then? How were you able to tell this is one so easily, just out of interest?
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: dragondollar on April 04, 2013, 12:53:18 PM
KONDi, what do you think about this Sinkiang dollar?

(http://images.pcgs.com/CoinFacts/26372250_large.jpg)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Eileenlab on April 04, 2013, 08:53:10 PM
I am so excited that I found this site and your awesome post.  I just fell into a lot of Chinese coins, and I have at least 6 different Fat Man coins.  I am very excited because I found, though your post, that I have a very rare variety.  Photo 26.   I posted a couple on ebay, under the same name that I am using here, and I really wish I saw this first!  I was wondering, if you would mind if I put a link to this post in my next listing, because, OMG this is a wealth of knowledge!!!!   So, now for my question.  I have a variety that is not listed here.  Right hand side of the obverse, approximately 4:00, there is a signature.... L. GIORGI Is this a fake? A special variety?   I really need to know now! I hope you are still online, I would love to post some pictures of these and learn which ones they are!  thank you soo much, again, for doing such a great posting!!
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: SANDAC on April 04, 2013, 10:23:03 PM
Welcome to CCF, Eileenlab!

"A picture is worth a thousand words", the best way to identify coins is to post pictures both front and back as well as the edge. 

Please be advised that "L. GIORGI" is very rare and fakes are abundant, so be prepared to be disappointed.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on April 05, 2013, 01:25:45 PM
Using one word: "Beautiful" :)
I have never seen such of beautiful condition for Sinkiang Yuan Shih Kai dollar 1914. Wonderful catch dragondollar!:)

KONDi, what do you think about this Sinkiang dollar?

(http://images.pcgs.com/CoinFacts/26372250_large.jpg)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Eileenlab on April 05, 2013, 05:09:18 PM
Can you tell me how to post a picture?  I clicked on the insert imagae and it just types this!!(http://)  I really want to send you  some pictures. I need help with these coins!
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: SANDAC on April 05, 2013, 07:00:46 PM
See this tutorial for uploading pictures
http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=7896.msg46156#msg46156
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Eileenlab on April 05, 2013, 10:22:55 PM
So, here are the 2 Fat Man varieties that I would really like to have someone look at.... The first one is the L Giorgi - how do I know that it is real and not a fake?  The second one is the Gansu.... I do have 4 more 1914, and I think that they might be all different varieties!!  I would love some opinions.Thank you!
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: SANDAC on April 05, 2013, 11:05:22 PM
I'm no expert, but I can tell you the L. Giorgi is a fake simply because the letters are too large.  See the photo of NGC certified L. Giorgi: http://www.ngccoin.com/certlookup/CertResults.aspx?CertNumber=2760782-002
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on April 05, 2013, 11:38:38 PM
Dear Eileenlab,

The Gansu fatman dollar with 2 chinese characters on both sides is also fake.

On obverse it has sharp edge also on small tooth are missing (close to a rim) or they are not clear.

On reverse there is the same problem--small tooth are missing...

Sorry both coins are fakes.

Such of coins it is better to buy on reputable auction house, but you must know they are very expensive.

Best wishes from Shanghai

KONDi
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Smartmorpheus on May 10, 2013, 12:46:06 PM
Dear friends i need your help to identify these two coins i recently got...

(http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/4796/fataak.jpg)
(http://img802.imageshack.us/img802/5783/fatb.jpg)
(http://img534.imageshack.us/img534/6217/chinakarabi.jpg)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Smartmorpheus on May 10, 2013, 02:00:26 PM
Three coins sorry ...
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on May 11, 2013, 02:55:58 AM
Dear Smartmorpheus,

I would be happy to help you and identify but 3 images doesn't want to upload and I can't see them.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Smartmorpheus on May 11, 2013, 08:46:11 AM
MAybe something wrong with uploading...Please identify the variety for this one and i will saw you the others As soon as possible..
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: SANDAC on May 11, 2013, 10:50:56 AM
Dear friends i need your help to identify these two coins i recently got...

http://img23.imageshack.us/img23/4796/fataak.jpg
http://img802.imageshack.us/img802/5783/fatb.jpp
http://img534.imageshack.us/img534/6217/chinakarabi.jpg

The images were not uploaded.  It is linked from imageshack.us.  See this link if you need instruction with picture upload:   
http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=7896.msg46156#msg46156
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Smartmorpheus on May 13, 2013, 02:08:41 AM
(http://imageshack.us/a/img23/4796/fataak.jpg)

(http://imageshack.us/a/img802/5783/fatb.jpg)

(http://imageshack.us/a/img534/6217/chinakarabi.jpg)


Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Smartmorpheus on May 23, 2013, 11:32:08 AM
Anyone?
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on May 23, 2013, 11:37:17 AM
Dear Smartmorpheus,

Like I said before...
I really would be happy to help you and identify but 3 images don't want to upload and I can't see them.
You have to attach them in a proper way.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: SANDAC on May 23, 2013, 12:46:14 PM
KONDi,
I downloaded the images from imageshack.us and uploaded them here.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Smartmorpheus on May 24, 2013, 06:55:14 AM
Thanks my friend.Please i need your opinion to identified the coins.... :(
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: pikipoki on June 02, 2013, 01:53:44 PM
Hi KONDi. What do you think about this coin. Is it fake or real? I got it from my grandmother 20 years ago. Thanks.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Smartmorpheus on June 02, 2013, 05:19:22 PM
Kondi please reply for my coins too
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on June 03, 2013, 12:18:43 PM
Hey Guys,
I have the answer for your coins and I will post it tomorrow with my analysis. There is some problem with show up "Internal Server Error". I hope it will get fix tomorrow.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on June 03, 2013, 12:24:24 PM
Dear Smartmorpheus and pikipoki,

Sorry guys for my late reply. I am recently very busy with something...

Unfortunately I must upset both of you. All coins are fake.

Smartmorpheus,

Let's do a general analysis of your 3 coins.
Nr 1 has sandy color. I circled sample areas when you can see it. I have seen similar fake coins with the same apperance and they all turned to be fake.
Nr 2 has bright appearance and also doesn't look genuine for me.
Nr 3 is the worst one. If all of them came from the same source then there for sure fakes!
Please take a look on the obverse of this coin. The first character which means "year" in English has unnatural size---bold size of this character. It has also some green spots on a surface. The apperance of Yuan's hair is not right. Normally the hair have different look.
The reverse is even worse! The 2 parts of second chinese character which means "yuan" in English "dollar" have not shapely size, please notice it. Finally the rim part: when you look up you can see the tiny line. It is like the rim is splited. When we will move down we can see partially disappearing teeth. To summarize they are all fakes came from all from one place and made of white copper.

pikipoki,

Thank you for your question and welcome to this great forum!

Sorry I have to tell you the same what I also told Smartmorpheus.
Your coin is also fake. But your coin is a different case.
It is silver-made fake. I can clearly see it from the apperance of your fatman dollar.
Why I think it is silver-made fake? Few things which I want to point:
First of all on the obverse one tooth has something like tiny pits (2 or 3). What is more. On the Yuan's face there are 4 scratches, which doesn't look like they are made during circulation. The other 2 smaller ones you can find on Yuan's clothes and on the reverse 3 on the rim. The part with stars doesn't look with details. I don't see those tiny lines close to stars' part. Finally on the reverse when we take a look down the part of the rim has a rough look and between one leaf there is like a tiny line added. Those all things doesn't look good. I have seen similar problems on silver-made fake 50 cents YSK 1914 a while ago.
Right now it doesn't promise that the coin which you got from your relative is genuine. Even it was a long time ago. If I am not wrong they started producing fake old chinese coins like 30 or even 40 years ago, in 1970s or 1980s.

Hope it helps somehow...

Best wishes from Shanghai

KONDi

PS. Photos will be tomorrow posted---will try my best. I have problem to attach them to this post because of this error N17.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: pikipoki on June 05, 2013, 04:32:01 AM
Hi KONDi. Thank you for your quick answer. I already thought that the coin is not real. I would still be really thankful if you could put the photos on where you mark the mistakes.

Best wishes from Slovenia.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on June 05, 2013, 05:42:24 AM
Dear pikipoki,

You are welcome. I will open new post. This post has educational purpose. I will open new post and try to post photos and one more time my analysis.

SANDAC, is it possible to close this post? It already overloaded. I have a problem to upload photos and help new members with their coins.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on July 30, 2013, 05:42:52 AM
Dear poconopenn,

It took me a while to find a proof that my People from Gansu (Kansu) variety of YSK 1914 (picture nr 4 on page 1 of this post) is not a fake coin. On a picture B1 you can take a look and compare my coin with the coin which was sold out as a lot 2503 on Nov.13, 2010 by Beijing ChengXuan Auctions Co., Ltd. Here is the link:
http://www.ichengxuan.com/antiques/31481/?searchterm=Yuan Shih Kai Kansu

The same case is is with my Xinjiang YSK 1914 ((picture nr 18a on page 1 of this post) which is genuine one. Please compare coins on picture: A1a.
lot 2008 on Nov.8-9, 2008 by Beijing ChengXuan Auctions Co., Ltd. Here is the link:
http://www.ichengxuan.com/antiques/12109/?searchterm=Yuan Shih Kai Sinkiang

Here my 18b - another Xinjiang YSK 1914 variety. I wasn't able to track the image of reverse of this graded PCGS on Beijing ChengXuan Auctions Co., Ltd. but I can be sure, by judging obverse that this is the same coin (PCGS one and my 18b).

There are many Xinjiang YSK 1914 varieties which I will present here later...
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on July 30, 2013, 06:49:57 AM
On a picture: 3 different varieties:

YSK nr 1: circled in red + red arrow: there is one leaf which is in a big distance to another leaf.
YSK nr 2: circled in red + red arrow: 2 leaves are close to each other.
YSK nr 3: circled in red + red arrow: 2 leaves are very close to each other and the 1st leaf is thiner than the 2nd one.

YSK nr 1: circled in green + green arrow: there are 3 leaves with the distance to each other.
YSK nr 2: circled in green + green arrow: 2 leaves are in the same distance to each other but the 3rd one is pointing into them.
YSK nr 3: circled in green + green arrow: there are 4 leaves: the fist 2 are close to each other, the other 2 in the distance.

Finally...
YSK nr 1: circled in blue + blue arrow: widely spread small two leaves on the top of bigger leaf.
YSK nr 2: circled in blue + blue arrow: narrower spread of small two leaves on the top of bigger leaf.
YSK nr 3: circled in blue + blue arrow: tips of narrower spread small two leaves which are on the top of bigger leaf (or it could be ribbon) touch another bigger leaf above.

There are more such of small details which distinguish one variety from another varierty. There are so many varieties of Xinjiang YSK dollar 1914 that it is hard to say there are only 2 and others are fake, No! Many are not discovered and moulds which they use in Xinjiang province were not so precisely, if not the worst from all local issued YSK coins. Well, maybe private issued YSK dollars were even worse than those Xinjiang ones. It is hard to judge it.

I also would like to post here another photo...A while ago dragondollar showed me his variety of Xinjiang YSK 1914. I found similar one on Beijing ChengXuan Auctions. The obverse is the same but the reverse shows differences, where? In location of leaves, number of leaves and shape of chinese characters.

That's not the first time Xinjiang coins bring us a lot of headaches. I am sure some of you remember once I asked dragondollar about my 5 miscals silver coin from Xinjiang province. It was hard to answer which exactly variety it is:
http://china-mint.info/forum/index.php?topic=4652.0

I hope you enjoy reading! Take care guys---keep an eye on your fatmen:)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: poconopenn on July 31, 2013, 06:35:22 PM
KNODi

First picture attached is an enlarged section of your Xinging coin. The lumpy surface suggests this is a low quality fake coin.

Second and third pictures show the shape and location of the first two Chinese characters of Kansu coin in your B1 picture.  Obviously, they are not identical. They are other differences in obverse and reverse of these two coins. IMO, it is a questionable coin, as mentioned in Reply 41 in this thread.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on August 09, 2013, 10:39:41 AM
Dear poconopenn,

Thank your for your answer.

As you know probably Xinjiang YSK dollars 1914 have low silver content. On the piece from ChengXuan Auctions (picture 2008). It also has bumpy surface, if you will take a look closely, so I disagree with you that this is low quality fake coin.

The location of first 2 Chinese characters of Kansu coin might be slightly different, but please notice that my coin was in circulation, while the other coin is in XF-AU condition. The coin on my photo also doesn't show enough clear details as photo of Kansu coin from auction house.

Reasonable would be send those 2: Xinjiang and Kansu coin to grading company. However I don't not own those coins a while ago.

IMO those 2 are both genuine, but I respect your opinion as well.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Dave82 on March 25, 2014, 09:33:25 AM
Hi Kondi,

I'm wondering if you can help me with the identification and value of the attached Fat Man dollar. My Mum handed me a bag of old coins and asked me to "get rid of them" in amongst them was this one - It's taken me ages to identify what it is ... I'm not a collector, and don't really know the first thing about coins having found and read this thread I even more daunted. The only thing I can say about it is that it was given to my mum around 1950 when she was working in a bank. Any info gratefully received. Thanks Dave
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on March 25, 2014, 12:30:53 PM
Hello Dave,

It is my pleasure to answer your questions. Your coin it's a Chinese dollar from 1914. On obverse it shows a bust of Yuan Shih Kai. Above there are 6 Chinese characters which stand for year (the first one from left side), then we have chinese character 3 which refer to a date (the 3rd year) abd finally 4 chinese characters which mean Republic of China (Republic of China dated from 1911 to 1949). So if you will add year 3 + 1911 you will have a date when this coin was issued. Simple isn't it? In US they call this coin Fatman dollar, in China it's called Yuan Shih Kai dollar or Big Head. It is common variety from 1914. In my humble opinion this coin is genuine in F-VF condition. On the reverse it has 2 chinese characters which mean "yi yuan" - one dollar, but I guess you knew that before:). About the value of this coin is that what collector is willing to pay. You can send me email: cfrost1984@gmail.com , I might have a customer for your Fatman dollar.

I hope my answer helped you somehow.

Best wishes from Shanghai,

KONDi
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: happycoins II on April 14, 2014, 06:04:09 AM
Hi, Kondi

Long time since our last communication. As you may be aware, I still enjoy acquiring old silver coins from China from time to time, and I like to discuss with you when I got a special type of YSK. 

Attached you will see 6 pieces of YSK, which I believe they are all different variety. The third one at the upper right should be a Shandong variety if I remember correctly. The third one at the lower right, I still don't know which variety it would be. The rest, I have no idea but I think they are all common variety.

What do you think?

Best regards from Bangkok,

Happycoins II   
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Juno Moneta on April 18, 2014, 07:24:07 PM
I have this YSK 20 Cents that was PCGS certified and further attributed as Communist Chinese issue - Comments Wanted!

http://www.moneta-coins.com/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=1767&title=yuan-shi-kai-20-cents&cat=556 (http://www.moneta-coins.com/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=1767&title=yuan-shi-kai-20-cents&cat=556)

JM
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Juno Moneta on April 18, 2014, 07:31:05 PM
Posting my example of a Sinkiang manufactured YSK $ - comments PLEASE!

http://www.moneta-coins.com/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=475&title=yuan-shi-kaisinkiang-issue&cat=556 (http://www.moneta-coins.com/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=475&title=yuan-shi-kaisinkiang-issue&cat=556)

JM
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: numisma2000 on April 22, 2014, 01:48:12 PM
Hi all from Spain,

I just bought my first "Fatman Dollar" and would like your opinion on it. On its condition and authenticity.
It is 1914 and the most common variety, I guess.
It weighs 26.60 grams and is 39 mm in diameter.

Thank you very much for your help.

(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7153/13965467091_a3517cfba4_h.jpg)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on April 23, 2014, 06:16:08 AM
Hi all from Spain,

I just bought my first "Fatman Dollar" and would like your opinion on it. On its condition and authenticity.
It is 1914 and the most common variety, I guess.
It weighs 26.60 grams and is 39 mm in diameter.

Thank you very much for your help.

(https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7153/13965467091_a3517cfba4_h.jpg)


Dear numisma2000,

Your first Fatman dollar 1914 is genuine piece! It looks like F condition for me.

Best wishes from beautiful Shanghai!
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on April 23, 2014, 06:18:15 AM
Hi, Kondi

Long time since our last communication. As you may be aware, I still enjoy acquiring old silver coins from China from time to time, and I like to discuss with you when I got a special type of YSK. 

Attached you will see 6 pieces of YSK, which I believe they are all different variety. The third one at the upper right should be a Shandong variety if I remember correctly. The third one at the lower right, I still don't know which variety it would be. The rest, I have no idea but I think they are all common variety.

What do you think?

Best regards from Bangkok,

Happycoins II   

Hi Happycoins II,

Happy to hear from you again. I am recently very busy in work, so please give me some time to reply about your 6 fatman dollars.

Will back to you as soon as I can.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: happycoins II on April 23, 2014, 08:44:41 PM
 N31
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: numisma2000 on April 24, 2014, 02:05:51 AM


Dear numisma2000,

Your first Fatman dollar 1914 is genuine piece! It looks like F condition for me.

Best wishes from beautiful Shanghai!

Thank you so much, Kondi. I was almost sure it was authentic, the seller can trust him, but you never know these coins, there are many fakes and some really good and is very difficult to distinguish, if not is an expert.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Contrapunctus on April 24, 2014, 12:15:51 PM
With the weathering, it looks genuine. But to be 100% sure, send for grading at PCGS or NGC.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: happycoins II on April 24, 2014, 10:32:26 PM
With the weathering, it looks genuine. But to be 100% sure, send for grading at PCGS or NGC.

The coin also looks genuine to me. However, I would rather suggest you keep the coin as it is because of the poor condition and the common nature of this coin.

All the best,
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Contrapunctus on April 25, 2014, 01:02:02 AM
The coin also looks genuine to me. However, I would rather suggest you keep the coin as it is because of the poor condition and the common nature of this coin.

All the best,

Same opinion, I will not send common and low grade coins for grading.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on May 21, 2014, 03:31:07 AM
Hello happycoins II,

I am so sorry you had to wait for my answer so long. I am very busy with my work and with my Shanghai tokens. Today I found a little bit time to answer your post about 6 Fatman dollars.

First of all congratulations! I think all of your 6 coins are genuine. You can be sure about it. Even 2 of those Fatman first time I see.

Let's get started shall we? First of all nr 1, 2 and 3 (which I marked) are Yunnan variety Fatman dollar 1914. The other sample of this variety you will find on the 1st page of this post---it is nr 17.


Nr 4 which I marked on your picture is a mystery for me. I believe I used to have this coin for sell and if I am not wrong it is Fujian variery. It is very rare variery if this is the one. The key point in this variety is the the shape of eye with 2 lines and part of the hair which look different than on other fatman dollar varieties from 1914. I could be wrong here. Like I said I believe I used to had this coins and I sold it and it looked the same and your nr 4. However it also had a little bit similar design to 20 cents Yuan Shih Kai 1916. But I am more convinced that your nr 4 could be Fujian variety. I didn't listed this variety here.

Your nr 5 is of course Shandong variety. Good catch!

Nr 6 is unknown variety of Fatman dollar 1914. I believe it is genuine. Only I have never seen it.

Good catch with all 6. They are all genuine in my humble opinion.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: happycoins II on May 21, 2014, 10:49:54 PM
Thanks for this, KONDi. I will find out more information about coins# 4 and 6.

Keep in touch,

Happycoins II
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: billygoat on June 26, 2014, 01:58:49 AM
Thanks so much for your interesting study on the varieties of the 1914 fatman.  One thing that I have noticed on the "o" mint mark types that you do not note is the generals collar.  On the ones I have seen, and the one I have (I believe I have the "third type" you mention) the front of the generals collar has a beaded or uneven appearance, rather than a strait look of other types. Please see the attached pics (I think they will attach) of the one I have.  I wonder if you could comment on this.  Thanks
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: billygoat on June 27, 2014, 01:46:58 PM
I would like any of the other folks on this forum to comment on the generals collar on the "o" mint mark coins as well.  Or any other issues realted to the coin I posted. Thanks in advance for your comments.

da Billygoat
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: ahsq on October 28, 2014, 05:25:33 PM
KONDi, are you still around?

Would you be able to give your opinion on some YSK dollars I have please?
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: ahsq on October 28, 2014, 11:30:04 PM
Hello all, I have a 1914 YSK, 1920 YSK, 1927 Memento and 1914 half dollar. Are they worth PCGS slot?

I have done some researches and I think the 1914 half dollar and the 1914 YSK dollar are worth PCGS?

I used a 10x loupe to look for scratches, dents, errors and etc

1. 1914 HALF Dollar: it should be AU55? Very few scratches or dents. Its in pretty good shape OBVERSE, it has couple PVC spots on REVERSE

2. 1920 YSK looks like a facsimile, its weights at 23grams.

3. 1914 YSK looks like a common date YUAN NC. It have lots of scratches and dents. Im actually not sure if its worth it to PCGS it. I think it'd be a F to XF only. :(

4. 1927 Memento looks like a common date. Has lots of scratches and dents. The only nuance is the OBVERSE side vines seem to be DD like :http://www.pcgs.com.cn/ValueView?cid=4207&specno=509213


Any and all help are greatly appreciated, I will be update as well.


Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: ahsq on October 28, 2014, 11:32:51 PM
pictures continues...
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: GeneO on February 02, 2015, 05:21:46 PM
Have been going nuts...I seem to have a 1914 Kansu Province "FATMAN" dollar in beautiful condition...When in Hong Kong - about 1958, I took it home... I can not find this coin listed anywhere.??? Is it a hard to find coin ???
Anyone have any idea on this one..?? Of course.. a picture would help..?? but need to figure how to list one here..
 Thanks all...GeneO
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Giantgg on April 19, 2015, 03:43:46 AM
Hi Kondi,
Check with you Yuan shih kai 3rd year given name by PCGS as below

(1914) $1 LM-63 Strg Col Wk Patch(Regular Strike) . The description do you understand what it means and according your variaties is what no in your list?

Thanks and regards
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Petterkr on May 19, 2015, 05:50:35 AM
Perhaps somone here could help me decide if this one is real, and if so, which type?

Petter
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Espen83 on May 19, 2015, 05:33:38 PM
What about this one? Weak strike? Fake? Notice no stars on the patch.

(http://i62.tinypic.com/yi16d.jpg)
(http://i57.tinypic.com/2vah1ko.jpg)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: hellcannon21 on May 24, 2015, 11:44:37 AM
http://moneymindau.blogspot.sg/2015/05/fatman-dollar-ysk.html?m=1url http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-lh_wmTsYtkg/VWHwi5bfzNI/AAAAAAAAAZQ/reaOxvVOZq8/s1600/IMG_20150522_083025.jpg[/url]

is this geniune? tnk

Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: poconopenn on May 24, 2015, 11:24:03 PM
This is a highly questionable Fatman silver dollar. Usually, when a coin has a highly polished rough surface, the chance of being a genuine is less than 1%. 
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: hellcannon21 on May 25, 2015, 01:32:38 AM
the weight and silver testing with magnet all passed. the 45 degree slidding test show that there silver content.pls do advice.tnk
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: hellcannon21 on May 25, 2015, 01:39:37 AM
poconopenn to whom are your answer refering to?tnk
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: hellcannon21 on May 25, 2015, 02:06:30 AM
by the way the shiny photo are taken with camera flash on.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: poconopenn on May 25, 2015, 05:18:27 PM
poconopenn to whom are your answer refering to?tnk

It is your coin. Most contemporary counterfeit has a correct weight and magnet test is only valid for coin containing iron.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: hellcannon21 on May 25, 2015, 06:27:35 PM
http://moneymindau.blogspot.sg/2015/05/ysk-coin.html?m=1    (http://moneymindau.blogspot.sg/2015/05/ysk-coin.html?m=1)


tnk, how about this pcs?
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: hellcannon21 on May 25, 2015, 06:46:30 PM
http://moneymindau.blogspot.sg/2015/05/ysk.html?m=1     (http://moneymindau.blogspot.sg/2015/05/ysk.html?m=1)

another 2 more coin from year 9 and 10 . are they geniune? tnk
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: hellcannon21 on May 26, 2015, 06:33:02 AM
poconopenn r u able to verfield? tnk in advance...
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: lymaninsley50 on May 26, 2015, 06:29:36 PM
1914 Kansu China Dollar with Charactures very extreemly rare tested and real silver.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: lymaninsley50 on May 26, 2015, 06:43:11 PM
REAL 1914 KANSU & NGC GRADABLE $35,000
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: lymaninsley50 on May 26, 2015, 06:45:25 PM
Now I'm looking for real L.Giorgi signed coins not the fakes.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: lymaninsley50 on May 26, 2015, 06:54:25 PM
This is the reverse of a 1928 china momento dollar & probably rarer than the 1912 momento /lower stars about 5 of these exist in ms grade & all are usually a 66 ngc listed at around $20,000,I got lucky and got it very reasonably price from the Ming Estate in Hong Kong for under that amount. Most were melted down on the mainland of China.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: lymaninsley50 on May 26, 2015, 06:59:43 PM
These are the two coins in my collection together like a happily married couple.The camera is a pawn shop Nikon for under a $100 bucks. ENJOY
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: poconopenn on May 26, 2015, 08:51:36 PM
poconopenn r u able to verfield? tnk in advance...

Sorry to tell you that all your coins are low quality counterfeit. The surface has too many pimples.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: hellcannon21 on May 27, 2015, 02:25:29 AM
tnk , u had save me paying some school fee.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: poconopenn on May 27, 2015, 04:02:18 PM
Perhaps somone here could help me decide if this one is real, and if so, which type?

Petter

This is a high quality reproduction.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: poconopenn on May 27, 2015, 04:11:59 PM
Administrator & moderators

I have trouble to post picture for the above post. I have tried three times and the following message was received.

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Please contact the server administrator, webmaster@china-mint.info and inform them of the time the error occurred, and anything you might have done that may have caused the error.

More information about this error may be available in the server error log.

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Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Petterkr on May 30, 2015, 06:54:34 PM
This is a high quality reproduction.

Thank you. Better return it. How so you see that it is a fake?
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: poconopenn on May 30, 2015, 10:20:21 PM
Thank you. Better return it. How so you see that it is a fake?

Please see the attached enlarged section of your coin.



Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: circuitjudge on July 07, 2015, 11:47:09 PM
Hello, I have acquired this supposed 1914 coin. I've found two anomalies: 1) the second character on the obverse does not conform to any of the six character coins I've seen, and 2) there are only three lines for the collar, when all others I've seen have four. Please assist me in identifying this coin. Thank you!
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: poconopenn on July 08, 2015, 12:20:20 AM
Hello, I have acquired this supposed 1914 coin. I've found two anomalies: 1) the second character on the obverse does not conform to any of the six character coins I've seen, and 2) there are only three lines for the collar, when all others I've seen have four. Please assist me in identifying this coin. Thank you!

Welcome to the forum!

This is a 1920 (not 1914) low quality reproduction.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: circuitjudge on July 11, 2015, 11:24:37 AM
Welcome to the forum!

This is a 1920 (not 1914) low quality reproduction.

Thank you. I could only find a couple pictures online that had the same characters on it as mine.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: T R U on July 14, 2015, 02:38:33 PM
REAL 1914 KANSU & NGC GRADABLE $35,000

@poconopenn. Can you please comment n this coin?
Are these coins genuine?
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: T R U on July 14, 2015, 02:50:55 PM
 :confused1:
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: poconopenn on July 14, 2015, 10:07:43 PM
@poconopenn. Can you please comment n this coin?
Are these coins genuine?

The pictures are not good enough to see the surface details.

Here are high resolution pictures of genuine coin. The first two pictures are NGC AU58 and the other pictures are for PCGS XF-45. 
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: poconopenn on August 30, 2015, 04:11:28 PM
Just for future reference.

Stack’s & Bowers Auction, August 2015, H. K.

http://www.stacksbowers.com/BrowseAuctions/LotArchive/tabid/805/ProductID/888966/AuctionID/6106/Lot/52090/Default.aspx

Condition Census Yuan Shih-kai Pattern Dollar

CHINA. Pattern Dollar, Year 3 (1914). Tientsin Mint. NGC MS-64.

L&M-72; K-643; KM-Pn32; WS-0166; Wenchao-pg. 534#858 (rarity three stars); Shanghai Museum-Mr. Shi Jiagan's collection-pg. 137#633; Sun-III-2-15. Struck in silver. Proposed pattern for the 1914 Yuan Shih-kai Dollar of Year 3 (1914) L&M-63. Vastly different from the adopted type as this piece features a three-quarters facing portrait of Yuan Shih-kai, rather than the left facing portrait found on the circulation issues. Two major varieties exist of this pattern designed by chief engraver Luigi Giorgi. This is an example of the first type which is unsigned and produced from dies with a brilliant finish. A lustrous obverse compliments the handsome portrait, with toning found to the peripheries. The reverse features an olive green toning which is seldom encountered and truly appealing, with faint iridescent hues found along the rim. Tied with one other piece for finest certified at NGC. PCGS grades this issue as specimen, of which there is just one in this numeric grade, none finer. Great eye appeal and an excellent example of this RARE and highly sought after type.

Estimate: $55,000.00 - $75,000.00

NGC MS-64.

Price realized: $83,650
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: allgeekspcstore on February 17, 2016, 11:15:31 PM
thanks for all the pictures. Love it!
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Hobub on June 06, 2016, 10:20:11 AM
Hello, I have just been asked to research the 1914 and I found your site. Please can you give me an idea of value? I see several different values listed and variables associated with this coin.

(http://china-mint.info/forum/gallery/0/61633_06_06_16_10_08_23.jpeg)

(http://china-mint.info/forum/gallery/0/61633_06_06_16_9_58_42.jpeg)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Hobub on June 08, 2016, 08:48:51 PM
Anyone??
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Deepwater on June 08, 2016, 11:00:07 PM
I think it is common variety and worth about $70-$80.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: LinnAili on July 24, 2016, 05:07:05 PM
Hello Kondi! I was doing some research on my "Fat man" coin online, and I happened to stumble upon this forum and your post. Sad to say that I know absolutely nothing about coins, and even less about Chinese coins.. (Hopefully that will slowly but surely change) A good friend of mine got me the coin for my birthday 2 years ago and since then my dear Fat man hasn't left my side for a moment.
My friend bought it in an antique shop in China and said the coin was roughly 100 years old. More than that I do not know. So now I turn to you. Is it possible to tell from these pictures what kind of variety of "Fat man" my coin is - or if it is a fake? It would make me super happy to learn more about my precious coin N3

Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: mateus on August 03, 2016, 06:15:23 AM

Hi !
What do you think about this one ? Good or bad ?
Thanks in advance !
mateus

(http://imgup.pl/di/IS00/6376459529.jpg)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: lex1705 on August 03, 2016, 10:58:41 AM
Hello!
What can you say about these one?Fake or not :blush:?
Thank you :001_smile:
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: kakla1234 on February 12, 2017, 01:37:47 PM
Dear, coin dealer or collector.
If my coin have chop-mark is it worth money? (it is not like many but just one or two) how much value would it be cost less?
Already, NGC graded it L&M 63(year 1914 common one).
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: century on October 26, 2017, 11:47:18 AM

Hello, Any help on these would be appreciated. Hard to determine value.
These came in a larger collection with some cast knife money, spade, etc. (thats a whole other set of research)

They are all 92.5-93% silver (xrf tested) and all weigh between 26.7-26.9g.

E
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: panda on October 31, 2017, 02:50:59 PM
Hello, Any help on these would be appreciated. Hard to determine value.
These came in a larger collection with some cast knife money, spade, etc. (thats a whole other set of research)

They are all 92.5-93% silver (xrf tested) and all weigh between 26.7-26.9g.

E

These 3 fatman dollars are all real, but with problem: chopmark, rim damaged, cleaned, etc

Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: century on November 01, 2017, 02:21:16 PM
These 3 fatman dollars are all real, but with problem: chopmark, rim damaged, cleaned, etc



What kind of value should I put on these?

Are chopmarks always a bad thing or are there some that people like?
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: panda on November 01, 2017, 02:47:32 PM
What kind of value should I put on these?

about $150 for 3 coins

Are chopmarks always a bad thing or are there some that people like?

For most of Chinese coins, chopmarks always bad, no people like.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: century on November 01, 2017, 02:59:38 PM
about $150 for 3 coins

For most of Chinese coins, chopmarks always bad, no people like.

Thanks for the help
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: pandamonium on November 01, 2017, 06:51:34 PM
Topic;  "Welcome to Chop mark collector club" on this forum......Search box.....
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: silvercoin on November 12, 2017, 07:48:35 PM
Can somone say if this is real and what its worth?
weight: 26,75 g - Diameter: 39,06 mm - Thickness: 2,36 mm
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: SANDAC on November 12, 2017, 08:22:23 PM
The coin is full of pimples.  It is hard to imaging a genuine circulated coin could look like that.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: panda on November 12, 2017, 08:57:30 PM
Can somone say if this is real and what its worth?
weight: 26,75 g - Diameter: 39,06 mm - Thickness: 2,36 mm

too bad it is fake
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: silvercoin on November 12, 2017, 09:01:00 PM
I wil send it in to see if they grade it. Let u know how it goes
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Yoyo on December 12, 2017, 10:54:49 PM
I believe I have the coin in photograph 7 based on the demarcation and history. Any idea on the value of this coin?
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Little Finger on December 13, 2017, 06:15:28 AM
Could be dirt and crud that accumulated over the years rather than pimples.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: KONDi on March 27, 2018, 08:37:17 AM
It's good that my post became the most popular and it's still alive :)
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: silvercoin on March 31, 2018, 02:56:25 PM
For the record, It came back from pcgs as not genuin.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: panda on March 31, 2018, 08:55:12 PM
For the record, It came back from pcgs as not genuin.

Sorry to hear that, I hope you didn't pay much for it.
Title: Re: Fatman dollar 1914-common but rare...
Post by: Biju on September 02, 2018, 01:14:45 PM
Hi got a couple of coins from an old collection. Please help me pinpoint the ID ..  Thanks in advance ..