Chinese Coins Forum

Features => Fake Chinese Coins => Fraud Alert => Topic started by: fwang2450 on July 31, 2017, 10:15:34 PM

Title: Altered key date cents on eBay
Post by: fwang2450 on July 31, 2017, 10:15:34 PM
A Korean seller is currently selling altered key date cents, two in NGC slabs:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rare-China-1981Y-1fen-unc-details/152644638299?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rare-China-1981Y-5fen-unc-details/152644638848?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rare-China-1980Y-5fen-unc/152644639475?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rare-China-1979Y-5fen-unc/152644639935?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649

The same seller sold an altered 1980 5 fen a few weeks ago.

Please watch out. No cherries to pick here.
Title: Re: Altered key date cents on eBay
Post by: poconopenn on July 31, 2017, 11:48:12 PM
Two raw coins (1979 and 1980 5 fen) are definitely altered coins. The pictures of two NGC graded coins are in poor condition and can not see the details. However, they appear to be identical to the pictures at NGC website, at least the holders of these two coins are genuine.

The seller also sold an altered 1957 1 Fen previously.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1957y-China-coin-unc-/162567054443?nma=true&si=ZxHg3hPvzHBAEkyFI7%252By0A2X6As%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
Title: Re: Altered key date cents on eBay
Post by: fwang2450 on August 01, 2017, 12:10:06 AM
On the two NGC slabbed coins, the counterfeiter forgot that the MS 1981 1 fen and 5 fen were produced by Shenyang Mint, not Shanghai Mint. They used the Shanghai Mint versions for alteration, with awn tips sticking out. It is a shame that NGC did not even notice this difference. The best solution is for NGC to buy them back.
Title: Re: Altered key date cents on eBay
Post by: poconopenn on August 01, 2017, 12:49:49 AM
On the two NGC slabbed coins, the counterfeiter forgot that the MS 1981 1 fen and 5 fen were produced by Shenyang Mint, not Shanghai Mint. They used the Shanghai Mint versions for alteration, with awn tips sticking out. It is a shame that NGC did not even notice this difference. The best solution is for NGC to buy them back.
i
Yes, you are right. The 1981 UNC version is from most expensive red folder mint set made by Shenyang, while 1981 proof set was made by Shanghai. These two NGC graded fen coins, appears to be proof version which are significant cheaper than UNC version.

Attached is picture of genuine 1957 1 Fen for comparison of altered 1957 1 Fen posted previously.
Title: Re: Altered key date cents on eBay
Post by: fwang2450 on August 01, 2017, 01:45:42 AM
i
Yes, you are right. The 1981 UNC version is from most expensive red folder mint set made by Shenyang, while 1981 proof set was made by Shanghai. These two NGC graded fen coins, appears to be proof version which are significant cheaper than UNC version.

They would be fine as proof versions, but these are altered business strikes.
Title: Re: Altered key date cents on eBay
Post by: poconopenn on August 01, 2017, 11:12:23 PM
They would be fine as proof versions, but these are altered business strikes.

These are the best altered coins I have ever seen. NGC really made a big mistake and let these two coins passed through its authenticating process.,

Picture (1), genuine 1981 1 fen and 5 fen UNC (original red book, Shenyang Mint).
Picture (2), genuine 1981 1 and 5 fen proof (Shanghai Mint)
Picture (3), NGC graded altered 1981 1 and 5 fen UNC details, copied from NGC website.

The 1 in the last digit of 1981 in the coins graded by NGC is clearly different from genuine proof coins. The design differences between proof and UNC are as marked, in additional to the size of 1981.
Title: Re: Altered key date cents on eBay
Post by: poconopenn on August 01, 2017, 11:32:06 PM
Just for information:

The valuation of 1981 1 Fen in MS 67 condition is about $3,500 and 1981 5 Fen in MS 67 condition is about $1,800, while proof 1 Fen is about $450 and 5 Fen is about $350.